Professional... Like?

[ZeroPresence]

Hmm, what's everyone's thoughts on the use of the word "fuck" and other curse words in the mod? Also the usage of leet speak.

I haven't gotten too far, I'm barely out of Downtown so far. And I already noticed a few uses of the word "fuck." I dunno, I just felt awkward when I read that in the lines, and I bet it would be even worse when I hear it. I mean, I curse and stuff sometimes, everyone does... but I think it gives off a vibe of being stupid. It kinda kills off the professionalism of the mod, you know?

Also... leet speak. Yeah... it's not really funny or cool. What's your thoughts on that?

I really hope I don't get any heat or "that's stupid.."

[Jonas]

Depends. Where did you see the l33t speak? Was it the board guests or the N00Bz gang or what?

As for the curse words, uhm... it'll only get worse from here, so I guess you better get used to it. Don't know what you mean about professionalism - ever seen Pulp Fiction?

[Phasmatis]

I have to agree with Zero, I wasn't shocked by the use of fuck but suprised, I think it's because Deus Ex didn't use swearing to get it's point across and it's seems strange that TNM does.

[Jonas]

Hrm, well I'm sorry but I'm not changing it unless it's blatantly out of place. The people in TNM who swear do so because it's in line with their characters, and there are quite a few characters who don't swear. If you could point out where you encountered a swear word that you didn't like, I'll decide if I want to change it or not (although if the lines have already been recorded, there is no changing it now).

I'm pretty sure people in DX did swear, there was a large discussion about that over at PDX, about whether DX would've been the same if Disney had owned ISA. And hey, if I was shot in the guts by a superagent, I would probably apply some profanity pretty liberally.

[DDL]

Swearing always seems stranger and more obvious when you see it represented as text, too. In audible conversation you barely even notice it. I would guess that the addition of VA would lessen any jarring effect, not enhance it.

Admittedly one caveat for Jonas is that you never notice your own usage of swearing as being jarring, since, well: you wrote the stuff. You hear it in your head automatically, and it sounds right. Others without the same mental mindset do not, and it sounds..less right.

I mean, I have heaps of swearing, and it sounds fine to me. I expect others will however have the same problems as you guys, though.


But anyway, personally I have so far not had any problems with the swearing in TNM, after the first "Oh right: it's a mod! They can DO that here" double-take.

[DDL]

Oh, and DX swearing, while used, was of the "shit/jesus christ" variety. This is colloquially referred to as "PG13" swearing.

You don't, sadly, get Manderly screaming "You killed Anna, you cocksucking fuckbag! I'm gonna rip your fucking face off and fuck your eyesockets!" through the infolink.

Having said that, I would've laughed incredibly hard if he had.

[Jonas]

I just re-read my post up there, and I didn't mean to make it sound so defensive. If you guys point out WHERE the swearing seems jarring, then I really will take a look at it and possibly edit it out. Just don't expect me to change Scara's swearing, because that's part of his personality. It's the only thing that keeps him from being a complete Bob Page ripoff

[ZeroPresence]

I have to agree with Zero, I wasn't shocked by the use of fuck but surprised, I think it's because Deus Ex didn't use swearing to get it's point across and it's seems strange that TNM does.

exactly! It's a game based off DeusEx, and I think it should be rated accordingly. Abomination saying fuck in his conversation is weird to me...

I think in games, the word "fuck" should only be used in dire situations, like in some FPS games I've played sometimes you would hear a soldier say something like "fuck! We've got contacts coming from the six!" Yeah, getting flanked isn't good times, so I can definitely see a well executed of the "fearful" fuck. But just casual conversation/mission giving? No... that's just stupid. Cursing all the god damn fuckin time for no fuckin reason makes you look like a moron, I think. I don't believe that message should be conveyed in the mod.

Also, the leet speak regarding the Noobz gang is completely acceptable and I felt that was executed very well, including the definition of Noob by the firewalls. But this should be avoided within casual conversation as well. As far as "casual" goes in an FPS.

[DDL]

It IS based around a bunch of fucking forumites, though. And we do tend to swear all the fucking time for no good fucking reason...

So at least it's accurate, if you see what I mean.

And like Jonas says, it's not like everyone is a foul-mouthed cretin..god knows, I considered sticking more swearing into my own few lines, but reading them, there was no way I'd actually use swearing in any places other than where I do.


I think the point is it's not gratuitous apart from where that's the point:

While it IS fucking possible to stick fucking swearing in all over the fucking place, it does seem fucking implausible after you've had a good few fucking minutes to peruse. Unless you're a big fucking maniac in a fucking huge corporate HQ trying to distance yourself from that fucking god-wannabe poser bob-fucking-page.

Though technically Scara distances himself from Page by being pretty up front about his desire to rule the world. Bob at least didn't try to rub your face in it all the time while mispronouncing your name.



Anyway, I do see your point, ZP. It just sounds like a fairly substantial thing to try to alter at this stage...

[Jonas]

Well I will have a look at how Abom uses it, because while he should be a brute, he shouldn't be stupid. Note that sounding stupid is not always an undesirable effect - there are characters in the mod who aren't exactly brilliant. So long as it makes the character (rather than the writer) sound stupid.

As for Scara, well... I had fun writing him. He has personality

He also has anger issues.

[Moonbo]

I also was a bit jarred by Abom's f-bomb.

-Gelo

[that guy]

I'm going to throw might vote in the DDL camp and say that swearing can add a lot to a conversation (though it doesn't always and so in specific examples I may agree with the ZP school of thought).

I should point out that I believe there has been a trend towards more swearing in games. In particular I have Prey in mind.

[Trestkon]

Ooo, excellent topic.

I'll agree that randomly inserted swearing can definitely ruin the atmosphere, but I also feel that it can (and has) been used effectively to paint a better picture of some of the character's personalities.

As Jonas said, though, if there are places where the swearing seems really out of place, we'll definitely look at it.

[Jonas]

While I believe Abom's calling the Goats "fuckers" served to illustrate how intensely he despises them, I have downgraded the curse to "bastards".

[DDL]

Assholes would also work.

Cocksuckers perhaps not.

Fucktards? Cockmonkeys? Spoogemongers?

This is fun!