The Latest - State of the project

Discussion related to the New Vision mod.

Moderator: DaveW

Post Reply
Schlumpf
Thug
Posts: 17
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 7:40 pm

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by Schlumpf »

Is these a replecment for bump mapping? looks similar for me. :-k
User avatar
Jonas
Off Topic Productions
Off Topic Productions
Posts: 14222
Joined: Sat Apr 24, 2004 9:21 pm
Location: Hafnia
Contact:

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by Jonas »

No, alpha channels are gradual transparency (a super awesome thing to have in Deus Ex), and Deus Ex does not support bump-mapping. Although it may with the D3D10 renderer (haven't checked), but you'd still have to create bump maps for all the textures, and I bet that's a fair way outside the scope of what Dave can handle on his own.
Jonas Wæver
Chief Poking Manager of TNM

You can buy my games on Steam if you like 'em.
Expeditions: Viking
Expeditions: Conquistador
Clandestine
User avatar
Nameless Voice
UNATCO
Posts: 143
Joined: Fri May 11, 2007 12:39 pm
Contact:

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by Nameless Voice »

What does this mean for people who want to play New Vision in Windows XP?
User avatar
DaveW
New Vision
New Vision
Posts: 2351
Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2005 10:03 am

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by DaveW »

None of the 'extra features' (i.e. some of the masked textures) will be enabled. You'll have to play on Vista/Win7 with a compatible card.

The download for said extra features won't be massive - it will be an add-on to New Vision, as Marijn has coded it into his renderer to accept texture 'over-rides'. That means that instead of compiling packages like I do now, I can just throw the textures into their respective folder structure i.e. "DeusEx/Textures/UNATCO/Metal/something.dds" - which means I circumvent Unreal Editor's texture restrictions, thus enabling full support for alpha maps.

It would be nice to do this for the main New Vision package, as updates would be ridiculously easy for me to do - but, the DX10 restriction is clearly an issue due to people using older OS's. The extra features will be good, though, and I'd recommend moving to Win7 anyway :)


In respect to Normal Mapping/DOT3 Bump Mapping - it is a possibility. The previous shot of the black walls was an attempt but I think I inverted the normals by mistake. Will have to see.
nerdenstein
Illuminati
Posts: 1591
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2008 7:40 pm
Location: Leicester, England, UK.

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by nerdenstein »

Damn this sounds interesting.
Just wish i knew what the hell you were going on about :mrgreen:
Well I do.. Sorta..
Anyway.

So the older OS's without DX10 Support and still gonna have awesome looking textures but that will be the 'Standard New Vision Package'? I gather the OpenGL Renderer is still gonna be used because that works a treat for me.
And then DX10 users will get the 'Extra features package' with more 'funky' looking textures?
I won't ask what these Extra features do/are exacly because i'm totally baffled as to what 'Alpha Maps' are..? :mrgreen:
But more to the point, I want Windows 7 NOW! :o :mrgreen:
Humm.. Wanting Windows 7 to play Deus Ex .. Who'da thought?

Thanks Dave your work is much appreciated!! :P
The real trouble with reality is that there's no background music.
User avatar
Jcelios
MJ12
Posts: 344
Joined: Mon Jul 14, 2008 8:13 am
Contact:

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by Jcelios »

I already love the parallax occlusion mapping and other features of the DX10 Renderer that work great with TNM + New Vision.
Even more excited about the final release now. :)
User avatar
DaveW
New Vision
New Vision
Posts: 2351
Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2005 10:03 am

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by DaveW »

nerdenstein wrote:So the older OS's without DX10 Support and still gonna have awesome looking textures but that will be the 'Standard New Vision Package'? I gather the OpenGL Renderer is still gonna be used because that works a treat for me.
And then DX10 users will get the 'Extra features package' with more 'funky' looking textures?
I won't ask what these Extra features do/are exacly because i'm totally baffled as to what 'Alpha Maps' are..? :mrgreen:
But more to the point, I want Windows 7 NOW! :o :mrgreen:
Humm.. Wanting Windows 7 to play Deus Ex .. Who'da thought?
Yes, that's right. What will be released soon is the base New Vision package, containing most of the textures re-done. This will work with the OpenGL renderer that is not OS-specific.

But, some textures still suffer because of engine limitations (so even if I increase their resolution, they'll still look crap). Using the features in this DX10 renderer, I can fix this. It might also be possible for me to use normal maps on certain surfaces to bring out extra detail and depth.

These features are not specific to DX10 - they could work with any renderer, such as the ENBSeries DX9 renderer that got released a while ago. However, the DX10 renderer is the only one still in active development, so this is what it's being coded for. Plus, the likelihood of Marijn transferring it to DX9 is unlikely, as the reason he chose 10 was the simplicity of the renderer (as 10 dropped a lot of legacy support, thus making it a more streamlined renderer).

So, for now, these extra features which will include a few new transparent textures and possibly normal mapping (the real selling point), will only be available on DX10 OS's (i.e. Vista and Win7). I'm not sure if there's a way to hack DX10 onto XP or not, if there is, then that would work too. These will just be an extra download pack that works alongside the base New Vision package.
Schlumpf
Thug
Posts: 17
Joined: Fri Jun 17, 2005 7:40 pm

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by Schlumpf »

@jonas

thx for the explanation. I ask only because i thought alpha replace the enbseries which works only with d3d9.
User avatar
Nameless Voice
UNATCO
Posts: 143
Joined: Fri May 11, 2007 12:39 pm
Contact:

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by Nameless Voice »

There are versions of DirectX 10 that are supposed to work in Windows XP floating around, but I've never tried one.
User avatar
DaveW
New Vision
New Vision
Posts: 2351
Joined: Sat Nov 19, 2005 10:03 am

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by DaveW »

Well, perhaps those will work. I mean, I'd recommend everyone to upgrade regardless because XP feels so archaic compared to Windows 7 (and I like XP, I use it on my netbook, but it's just not as good). Not that Direct X 10 is a real reason to switch, there's nothing special about it.

I really wish I had more time on my hands to experiment with this, but I have film shoots coming up this week so I probably won't:
Image

About 1 minute in CrazyBump produces this. The light source is fixed to 'just above' the texture, as the bump maps can't react to light sources in the environment due to engine limitations. But, it still produces a great depth effect that would be difficult for me to do for a lot of these textures without wrecking them.
Mr_Cyberpunk
Illuminati
Posts: 3441
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2005 3:57 am
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Contact:

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by Mr_Cyberpunk »

Me and Dave were talking about that just the other day. Glad to see it finally got some results. The bar scene looks great. Man I wish we had Alpha Channels when we first started, it was such a pain in the ass doing it the old way- Anti-Alaising is truly a luxury :D but a good one.

Best of luck with testing this out. Can't wait for the results.
Hashi
Silhouette
Posts: 517
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2007 3:13 pm

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by Hashi »

this shit is more epic than I thought. The final product of NV + HDTP is going to be too leet for mere words to explain how leet its going to be
User avatar
Angel-A
UNATCO
Posts: 119
Joined: Tue Feb 09, 2010 3:35 pm
Location: Florida
Contact:

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by Angel-A »

Leetgasm to the fourth power? \:D/
Image
justanotherfan
Illuminati
Posts: 2285
Joined: Sun Feb 27, 2005 11:28 pm

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by justanotherfan »

That really does look excellent.

It's disappointing that DX10 is going to be required for the best appearance, since I do like OpenGL, but at least WINE is implementing DX10 compatibility quite well, so Windows Vister and Sevin might not be necessary. I remember there was a supposedly successful hack to get DX10 under Windows XP, and I tried it for a while under 2003. At least DX10 is an addition to the game requirements that should please the 1000$-Videocard gamers.
Soundwave
Mole Person
Posts: 4
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 9:06 am

Re: The Latest - State of the project

Post by Soundwave »

1000$-Videocard gamers
1000$ ?! DX10 has been around for so long that even the low-key DX11 and cheap DX10 cards should eat New Vision for breakfast.
A GTS250 sells for around 150 bucks here and is more than fast enough for NV.
Post Reply