So, about the UDK

[loony636]

I've had the idea of playing around with the UDK for a whole now, and it recently struck me that it might be a fertile ground to try some Deus Ex remaking (like Deus Ex: Reborn). I've seen some evidence of people attempting similar projects before, and I'm sure it won't take long fore to discover my own substantial limitations, but let's put that aside for the moment.

I'm going to spend some time poking the UDK, but in the mean time I'd be interested in hearing the limitations of a direct port of Deus Ex's assets into the UDK. I presume scripts wouldn't work, but what about models and maps? Or even kist conversations? It's been an age since I've even looked at UnrealEd, so I can't remember how Deus Ex does those things.

Again, such a project would probably remake most of those assets anyway, but it would be nice to know if it were even possible to just hit 'import' on the Deus Ex install directory.

And for general reference, I've had a bit of experience mapping JKA (so, the Quake engine with GTKRadiant) and modding Kotor generally. I originally wanted to do something similar with the latter, but LucasArts apparently has a pretty strict porting policy.

Anyway, thanks for humouring my interest.

[Blade sword]

That's pretty good but you need a good team for this and proper authorizations for these.
I actually can provide you with a few weapon models since I modeled a stealth Pistol and a LAW
I have a question too about Deus Ex and weapon models in matters of polycount and format.

Does it takes psk / psas like UE 2 and UE 3 games and what is the polycount that the game can handle withour problems, because my current weapons are pretty high polygoned

[DaveW]

I've had the idea of playing around with the UDK for a whole now, and it recently struck me that it might be a fertile ground to try some Deus Ex remaking (like Deus Ex: Reborn). I've seen some evidence of people attempting similar projects before, and I'm sure it won't take long fore to discover my own substantial limitations, but let's put that aside for the moment.

I'm going to spend some time poking the UDK, but in the mean time I'd be interested in hearing the limitations of a direct port of Deus Ex's assets into the UDK. I presume scripts wouldn't work, but what about models and maps? Or even kist conversations? It's been an age since I've even looked at UnrealEd, so I can't remember how Deus Ex does those things.

Again, such a project would probably remake most of those assets anyway, but it would be nice to know if it were even possible to just hit 'import' on the Deus Ex install directory.

And for general reference, I've had a bit of experience mapping JKA (so, the Quake engine with GTKRadiant) and modding Kotor generally. I originally wanted to do something similar with the latter, but LucasArts apparently has a pretty strict porting policy.

Anyway, thanks for humouring my interest.

I realise this is only bumped from some necroposting - but hopefully this will be of some use anyway.

Very little from Deus Ex would be directly importable into UDK. Music is a no-no, textures might work, maps would probably work (kind of) and models would require recompiling. It'd be a lot of work.

You could use HDTP's assets but you'd have the same problem (the easiest place to get all the assets in a 'complete' form would be from the final compiles)

Plus the entire structure of the engine has changed since Unreal Engine 1. The old 'System' 'Textures' 'Music' directories were last seen in UE2, 3 has a simpler structure.

Then, there's the copyright issue. Eidos wouldn't allow you to make their game available for free. Maybe you could convince them by requiring people to have some original files from Deus Ex in order to play your mod, but I'm sure Eidos would simply tell you not to do it.

[Neveos]

actually eidos gave such mods a go-ahead as long as you don't make money off of them. http://forums.eidosgames.com/showthread.php?t=100371

The fact that one could possibly import the maps, alone, is an incredibly exciting thought. Obviously newer models would take the place of everything in the map. You would just need to recreate the logistics.

[DaveW]

Then I stand happily corrected.

If you were interested in making a modern version of the game, though, you'd be better off roughing out the maps with dev textures and starting over. The old geometry isn't going to help you. Pretty much everything would need to be done with meshes, anyway.

[Neveos]

I wish they had released an sdk of human revolution. You'd be pretty much set.

[Venom3]

Hey Guys!

Once I did similar stuff...
I was able to export Deus Ex' Maps without any problems. Just use in the UnrealEd the Builder-Brush and then intersect it, to get the shape of the map. Then you can export it using the Brush --> Export option.
The UDK also offers the option to export / import brushes. And thats what we would do using the exported brush.

Of course the textures are missing then, but you got the same shape of the maps, so you only need to texture.

I must admit that I took DaveW's textures as High-Res ones, and created a normal, specular and heightmaps from them. It looked pretty awesome! I really liked the HongKong-chapter, and I had so many things textured, I also exported the music. My dad went once into my room and said "I can't remember that Deus Ex looked so good! But what's that weapon?" So I really had all the maps nearly looking the same, but my map looked better

I also really like the UDK's materials. They are pretty easy, and creating some reflective materials is not a problem.

But when I need to script something, I've lost, because I don't know very much. I know different functions and variables but thats it. I can only code a little "Hello World" Script. All users who read this, could you maybe tell me some very good and easy Scripting-Tutorials for beginners? I really would like to learn it. And yes, I know that this isn't that easy.



What a long text But Deus Ex in UDK is a very interesting topic for me

-Venom

[Neveos]

sounds like you have a cool dad

[DaveW]

I must admit that I took DaveW's textures as High-Res ones, and created a normal, specular and heightmaps from them. It looked pretty awesome! I really liked the HongKong-chapter, and I had so many things textured, I also exported the music. My dad went once into my room and said "I can't remember that Deus Ex looked so good! But what's that weapon?" So I really had all the maps nearly looking the same, but my map looked better

I'd love to have two things:

Higher resolution lightmaps
Self-illumination textures

Oh, and decent UV tools in UnrealEd rather than the piece of shit alignment tools in Ued1/2. Then I could make the maps look decent in the original engine.


I'd be interested to see your UDK experiments though

[Venom3]

@DaveW

Okay I'll show you some levels of the HongKong Chapter soon. But I had to format my computer a while ago, and havn't saved that files...

BUT!

I'll create them all again! Just give me some time, I'll show you soon. I promise

-Crim

[Marcelo]

Very interesting idea. Pretty much like Black Mesa project but for DX.

[Suvlaco]

A big hell yes to this. I'd love to see that happen but I feel it is unlikely =p If anyone ever gets this underway though I'd be keen and I know my way around mapping on the UDK.

[Suvlaco]

Hey Venom3, I've been doing some experimenting with this but running in to some troubles, and wondering if you had the same problem or if you found a way around it.

I worked out how to export the maps and import them, but due to the Additive based system of UDK, I need to add a large solid brush that is Built before the map itself, as the map subtracts itself from the brush.

However, I have found that door ways that are made through subtraction don't work, and the only way around this is to basically manually recreate the brushes...
Have you found an easier way to deal with this? Because in this case it'd almost be easier to just re-make the levels by hand, with the UED1 and UDK open at the same time to jump between the two for reference.

[AlvinD]

Show us screenies!

[loony636]

Woah! This thread unexpectedly came to life! I go overseas for, well, quite a while and come back: Bam!

I actually found a thread posted here from about a year ago, discussing these same issues. They concluded pretty much the same thing: Map structure yes, models no.

I followed on with my research and managed to get maps to import pretty well. The biggest issue is that map construction has changed from 'subtractive' to 'additive' brushes since Deus Ex (at least, I think those were their names), and the UDK has actually dropped support for the former entirely. Its not a massive issue; you just need to make a giant box around the level, but it does mean that build times take a dive. There's actually a program that will 'convert' the maps, but it doesn't support Deus Ex maps very well, so it basically just gives you the brushes and nothing else (while it purports to also work with textures, models and the like).

Placeables (or 'static meshes' as they're referred to in the UDK) have also been changed, meaning that you'd have to recode and reimport every single placeable in the game. Doors? Gotta redo those.

But you can get the brushes in the engine, and then import the textures. The original lighting is there, but obviously you'd want to redo that (as well as the textures to take advantage of it). The biggest issue I saw with the assets was just getting the remaining models in game; I never even really got started on the process.

But the biggest pain with the game is that the UDK is just an engine. Its not a game, meaning that it has no actually 'game' features for you to use. There's no dialogue systems, no inventory, no journals, no quests and no interface. More than that, there's no AI. Everything would have to be coded from the ground up. I saw some promising work with SQL databases, and I'm pretty sure that would be the only thing versatile enough to fill the entire game and all its variables (I think Morrowind or Oblivion used a similar system, and obviously most games use some pretty sophisticated data storage techniques).

There's also the issue of design. You can't 'copy' the HUD or menus; you'd have to remake them from scratch. Its not impossible, but the design tools you've got to work with for some of the more dynamic onscreen stuff (it uses a system called canvas, I believe, whereas the HUD is designed in Flash of all things) is pretty limited. Not impossible, but a lot of work to come up with a system that maintains the feel of the original game. The additional issue is that the scripting engine is a lot poorly documented than it could be, and most users seem to use a much less functional cinematic engine for their games. Its fine on a small scale, but when you've got literally hundreds of scripted components all firing at once, you can't rely on individually coding a cinematic for each one; you've got to have instantly reproduceable code you can universally modify instantly.

I actually wrote a full list of required 'tasks' that I can upload (and I could take some screenies if people are interested); I gave it a lot more thought before I went overseas. The single biggest issue I thought was a macro problem; I never saw how you would make the game 'a game'. That's the problem I think Black Mesa has at the moment; they've got a legacy of a game that they've converted into a bunch of connected maps with some things to shoot at, but it takes a lot more than that to make it fun. Likewise with Deus Ex, you could import the models, maps and dialogue from the original game, but it would take a lot more love to make it a game worthy of the title.

So not impossible (at all), but long, arduous, and definitely harder than you'd think at first.