Emulating PS2 Deus Ex - The Conspiracy

[G-Flex]

Grid based Inventory (sadly so flawed though, dont know how they could have messed this up, they had System shock 2s great inventory system to learn from)

Having recently playing SS2 again, I'm curious why you think SS2's grid inventory system is superior. They're variations on basically the same system, but in Deus Ex there's the added benefit that larger weapons actually take up more space. What did you prefer about SS2's system?

[kdawg88]

I agree the SS2 system is better, the DX grid becomes a bit of a mini-game at times given that you can't rotate the larger, rectangular items. They both work well on their own merits though - big weapons in DX are easier to obtain and use than in SS2, whereas even if you find the 'big' guns in SS2, you may not have the skill or ammo to use them, so I think it's right that they should be easier to carry.

[Cybernetic pig]

Well it is probably just me, but I think the inventory size should have been upgradable, DX is the only game with a grid based inventory I know of that cannot get any larger at some point in the game, there is just not enough space to experiment enough unless you don't carry a heavy weapon, and Environmental training is already useless enough as it is without having to carry around unstackable HEV suits etc. Then there is the issue with the searching bodies bug picking up all the items everytime.

Shoulda been done like this Imo: Choose 1 of the following Arm Augs-
1. Microfibral muscle & Combat strength Combined
2. Increased inventory size, even if its 1 column and/or row.
That would have had gamers making real decisions. Most of the augs are no brainers which is another shame in my favourite game.
Or they could have turned swimming skill into fitness like shifter which could have effected inventory size, then bumped up the skill point costs for it.

As for why I think SS2 Inventory is better; it is just a lot larger once upgraded, easier to experiment, yet still forces you to make meaningful decisions. The only problem I have with it is the weapons being the exact same size, but half the weapons are useless in that game anyway I end up using the same guns each playthrough, only ones I ever swap some playthroughs are Wrench for Laser rapier & EMP rifle for fusion cannon. Also you never get the irritating "You cannot drop that here" msg. I dunno they both have pros and cons but I feel SS2's is more complex yet more accessible (including the mechanics that are linked to the inventories in both games). I like the toolbar in DX though.

big weapons in DX are easier to obtain and use than in SS2, whereas even if you find the 'big' guns in SS2, you may not have the skill or ammo to use them, so I think it's right that they should be easier to carry.

Yeah Good point, + Most of the Big guns in ss2 are just crap anyway. Whilst the Big guns in DX are alot more fun, they really do take up too much space. Good thing I already done a heavy weapons run on the ps2 version, GEP gun, Flamethrower & Plasma rifle in one playthrough lol. Isnt as overpowered as you might think either even all fully upgraded + max heavy weapon skill. Except the Gep gun but I dont use it much, LAW too. And of course I was playing on Realistic also.

[Cybernetic pig]

the DX grid becomes a bit of a mini-game at times .

That is what grid based inventory is all about! Meaningful decisions, managing your resources and "inventory tetris"! FUN. its just in DX the searching bodies bug makes it a chore, every damn time you search a body you pick up crap you dont want. The fix for this is an official patch or Shifter & Biomod I cant remember?? They decided the fix for it in the PS2 version was simply making your inventory unlimited except weapons and stacking limits, damn shame. At least it is better than Bioshocks inventory though, which is straight up unlimited, except ammo but you can get ammo anywhere..

[DDL]

You'd prefer the game to stop everytime you searched a body, so you could manually click on every item you wanted? That actually sounds more nightmarish than the current system, especially since 70% of the time it's going to be "7.62mm ammo yes, combat knife no" (and you can streamline that by simply carrying a combat knife with you.. )

I admit that the total lack of visual information as to what a corpse might be carrying is..annoying, but I've never found "picking up a ton of crap you don't want" to be a problem, combat knives aside (but as noted, fix for that as above). What fix does shifter/biomod introduce?

Also,

Most of the augs are no brainers which is another shame in my favourite game.

Really? Off the top of my head I can only think of aqualung and run silent that are truly useless, and run silent is only useless because crouch walking with speedaug does the same job (and rarely is the 'noise caused by jumping down' a real problem). Aqualung would be more useful if the game actually had more water (though really, even then..pffft nah). The rest are all pretty hard choices (or at least, playstyle-determined ones).

[fantsu]

Aqualung is ok.
I never bother to use skillpoints in swimming, and really dont want to carry rebreathers with me.

It is weak, but it has still some use. Some, minor use.

[Cybernetic pig]

Dbl post

[Cybernetic pig]

snip

Hmn good points. I just needed to see it from a different perspective, manually searching bodies would slow the gameplay down some. Works fine in System Shock 2 & DX:HR though...

Really? Off the top of my head I can only think of aqualung and run silent that are truly useless

Yep you are right, most are balanced. Think I need to play DX again! get my facts straight, apparently ten playthroughs is not enough. But a couple id have liked to have seen as passive augs though. also I actually always pick aqualung and use it. I like swimming If I remember correctly there is also a couple of extra underwater secrets they added in the PS2 version.
But yeah augs are mostly balanced for each slot. I dunno what made me say otherwise.

[Cybernetic pig]

Aqualung is ok.
I never bother to use skillpoints in swimming, and really dont want to carry rebreathers with me.

It is weak, but it has still some use. Some, minor use.

Aqualung>Environ resistance imo (by a small margin). There is many more bodies of water than environmental hazards, and most hazards can be avoided with ease, but a secret in the water can only be gotten by swimming. Also alot of the areas where there is radiation there is rarely items....Though Regeneration fully upgraded counters both drowning and radiation IIRC. Also Aqualung & Environmental resistance are the two that should have been passive.

[DaveW]

snip

Hmn good points. I just needed to see it from a different perspective, manually searching bodies would slow the gameplay down some. Works fine in System Shock 2 & DX:HR though...

I really dislike having to manually pick out the stuff I want, but to be honest I can't think of a better way to do it. I hate my inventory getting full up with crap in Deus Ex. I go to pick up a weapon and I can't, and then I go into the inventory and find it's because I've got cigarettes and combat knives taking up all the space.

Maybe one tap to grab ammo, then another to search for other items (that you select from) - and you only pick up their gun by pressing E on the actual weapon next to the body.

[Cybernetic pig]

Maybe one tap to grab ammo, then another to search for other items (that you select from) - and you only pick up their gun by pressing E on the actual weapon next to the body.

Not bad. Still the way DX:HR done it was an improvement imo, except having to pick up every individual weapon for scraps of ammo.

[Hassat Hunter]

DX:IW did the weapon pickup thing... and it sucked.

Psysics blown away items you have to hunt down... rather have DX's system.
Oddly enough can't recall how DX:HR did it anymore...

[Cybernetic pig]

.
Oddly enough can't recall how DX:HR did it anymore...

Press interact on body (or top draw), brings up 3 slots, press interact again to take all items. Alternatively you can select an individual item and "uncheck" it before you take all. Good mechanic, but what slowed it down was picking up the weapons, especially when you have one hidden under a body, or gets blasted across the room like in invisible war. At least its kinda realistic though it is what you would have to di in real life, scavenge ammo like that. Still the random generation of scavenged ammo from a weapon was poor. should have been between 2-8 or something not 1-6. well it depends on the weapon too I think but even combat rifle ammo gave a similar amount. But at least ammo being so limited forced me to use stealth and other improvisations at times.

[DDL]

Also prevents anyone having more than three things, similar to bioshock.

Which is a bit rubbish, really. Especially if you want to add character to NPCs.

[Hassat Hunter]

Having limited ammo is good in my eyes. DX also had, what, 1-3?
Prevents the game from being really easily played as shooter, killing a foe and have bonus ammo from the body to boot. Atleast you need to hunt around for ammo or other items still.