Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

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bobby 55
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

Post by bobby 55 »

VectorM wrote:
Unfortunately I can see that being a very real possibility. The Free (!?) Market goes belly up again
Yeah, with government regulation, such BS would not happen! So how long did it take you to get R18+ and why can't I play L4D without cenzorship over there in Australia?
If you mean R18+ for movies, that's been around a long time here.

The R18+ business for games is still in the works AFIK. To play games, well more to the point for publishers to get the game past our censors, the offending content either gets toned down or removed. Sometimes it's impactful violence, drug use, or torture that they come down on pretty hard.
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

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Jonas wrote:I guess the free market involves the freedom to restrict your own products :?
Actually, turns out this might be illegal under EU law about freedom of competition or something like that.
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Oh, you mean the FRAPS footage that I posted ALMOST 2 WEEKS AGO?
brodude I don't reread old posts. But yeah, would you look at that. I guess my reactions just aren't good enough cause I thought it was cutscene mode until after he fired.
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VectorM
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

Post by VectorM »

DaveW wrote:
VectorM wrote:So how long did it take you to get R18+ and why can't I play L4D without cenzorship over there in Australia?
Responsible regulation of a market ≠ censorship.
Even though that's exactly what they are doing? And you do realize that practices that people typically accept as censorship (banning certain words from TV, etc.) are also hidden behind the same "Reasonable regulation" type bs?
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

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VectorM wrote:
DaveW wrote:
VectorM wrote:So how long did it take you to get R18+ and why can't I play L4D without cenzorship over there in Australia?
Responsible regulation of a market ≠ censorship.
Even though that's exactly what they are doing? And you do realize that practices that people typically accept as censorship (banning certain words from TV, etc.) are also hidden behind the same "Reasonable regulation" type bs?
I think you misunderstand me. What you seemed to be suggesting is that you either have a free market, or you have censorship.

If you have an entirely free market, DRM like this happens. If you go for censorship, well, you get Australia pretty much. Most countries strike a balance. There's shades of grey between the two.
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

Post by Dragon »

Jonas wrote:Apparently digital copies are not region locked.
Germany begs to differ as it happened there already. Don't know though if DX:HR goes that far. Time will tell.
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

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I was specifically talking about DX:HR. Eidos have said the digital versions won't be region locked.
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

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w00t, w00t, gaYm is leekt on da EKSBOKS, dat imposible! Onli PeeSees has pierats!
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

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Yep, PS3 and 360 versions leaked.
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

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VectorM wrote:w00t, w00t, gaYm is leekt on da EKSBOKS, dat imposible! Onli PeeSees has pierats!
This joke was funny the first 20 times this happened. Now its just sad.

In truth, it has become the norm for the console versions(at least the 360 one) to be leaked before the PC version.
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

Post by Jonas »

If we're being honest with ourselves though, a leak is likely to do less damage on the consoles than on PC, for a couple of reasons. First of all, to actually play those pirated copies requires that your console is physically modified, which most people are incapable of or unwilling to do, not least because it voids your warranty (and that's not something you want to do on an Xbox, which may at any point melt its own motherboard without warning). Secondly I'm pretty sure the percentage of PC gamers who know how to find, get, and burn torrents is significantly greater than the percentage of console gamers for whom this is true.
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

Post by Jaedar »

Jonas wrote: Secondly I'm pretty sure the percentage of PC gamers who know how to find, get, and burn torrents is significantly greater than the percentage of console gamers for whom this is true.
I'm sorry, but that argument sounds a lot like "console gamers are too dumb to pirate" and even as someone who uses the term consoletards at times I find it to be offensive. I refuse to believe that there are people who play games that are incapable of googling "How to pirate games for [console]".
Jonas wrote:First of all, to actually play those pirated copies requires that your console is physically modified
Do they still need that? Pretty sure that pirates have advanced enough that you only need to make software mods(which can presumably be reversed somehow), at least on the 360.
Jonas wrote:If we're being honest with ourselves though, a leak is likely to do less damage on the consoles than on PC
Eh, not so sure about that. Console games tend to sell most of the copies in a very short period of time just after the games release whereas the PC sales tend to be a bit more evenly distributed(but still peaking around release). Naturally, its hard to know if this matters for piracy, but I think it might have a significant impact. Not to mention the fact that scores of PC-pirates take steam sales and such things as opportunities to go legit, which means they will at least pay some money at some point, to my knowledge, consoles have no phenomena like this.

I could just be talking out of my ass though since I don't own a console other than the wii.
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

Post by DaveW »

Jaedar wrote:I'm sorry, but that argument sounds a lot like "console gamers are too dumb to pirate" and even as someone who uses the term consoletards at times I find it to be offensive. I refuse to believe that there are people who play games that are incapable of googling "How to pirate games for [console]".
It didn't sound like that at all. And besides, a lot of console gamers are too dumb to pirate.
Jaedar wrote:Do they still need that? Pretty sure that pirates have advanced enough that you only need to make software mods(which can presumably be reversed somehow), at least on the 360.
Yes, you still need it to be chipped. And Microsoft have ways of dealing with that.
Jaedar wrote:Eh, not so sure about that. Console games tend to sell most of the copies in a very short period of time just after the games release whereas the PC sales tend to be a bit more evenly distributed(but still peaking around release). Naturally, its hard to know if this matters for piracy, but I think it might have a significant impact. Not to mention the fact that scores of PC-pirates take steam sales and such things as opportunities to go legit, which means they will at least pay some money at some point, to my knowledge, consoles have no phenomena like this.
I don't know where on earth you're getitng any of that information. As someone who pirates essentially all his games except multiplayer titles I want to play (Killing Floor, Left 4 Dead 2 etc.) I don't take Steam sales as a chance to 'go legit' at any point. Anyone who pirates games not for a 'trial run' basis is unlikely to give two thoughts to just pirating titles, because they clearly don't care about being legitimate.

As for the suggestion that piracy on the PC is not ridiculously more widespread than on consoles, well, I can't believe you're serious. Type "Modern Warfare 2" into a well known torrent site, for example, and 1000 people are seeding the PC version. The highest seeded 360 version is 300. PS3 is 30.
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

Post by Jonas »

Jaedar wrote:I'm sorry, but that argument sounds a lot like "console gamers are too dumb to pirate" and even as someone who uses the term consoletards at times I find it to be offensive. I refuse to believe that there are people who play games that are incapable of googling "How to pirate games for [console]".
Even though you wrote "even as someone who uses the term consoletards at times", I find your taking offense to be hilariously hypocritical! :lol:

Did I claim the average console gamer is incapable of researching piracy and learning how to do it? No. I claimed there's far more console gamers who've never pirated software than there are PC gamers, and I stand by that. Realise that there are people out there who purchase pirated games. Realise that the Madden, FIFA, and NHL/NFL/NBA/ACRONYM games actually sell, in great numbers, on an annual basis, to people who are so far removed from what you might consider "gamers" as to essentially be a whole other species of consumer.
Do they still need that? Pretty sure that pirates have advanced enough that you only need to make software mods(which can presumably be reversed somehow), at least on the 360.
That's possible, I'm not sure.
Eh, not so sure about that. Console games tend to sell most of the copies in a very short period of time just after the games release whereas the PC sales tend to be a bit more evenly distributed(but still peaking around release). Naturally, its hard to know if this matters for piracy, but I think it might have a significant impact. Not to mention the fact that scores of PC-pirates take steam sales and such things as opportunities to go legit, which means they will at least pay some money at some point, to my knowledge, consoles have no phenomena like this.
Well there are sales in retail stores, but I agree somebody who has gone through the trouble to pirate and burn a console game is less likely to pick it up when the price drops in their nearest game store than a PC pirate would be to purchase a game they've already played in a Steam sale. A similar factor that might pull slightly in the opposite direction is that if nothing else, a console pirate will not be selling their copy of the game back to Gamestop for their used games racket.

There's also the question of multiplayer of course. If you pirate a multiplayer PC game you can often get it working on a fake LAN with Hamachi. If you pirate a console game you can forget about the multiplayer.
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

Post by Jaedar »

DaveW wrote: I don't know where on earth you're getitng any of that information. As someone who pirates essentially all his games except multiplayer titles I want to play (Killing Floor, Left 4 Dead 2 etc.) I don't take Steam sales as a chance to 'go legit' at any point. Anyone who pirates games not for a 'trial run' basis is unlikely to give two thoughts to just pirating titles, because they clearly don't care about being legitimate.
Take this for example: http://2dboy.com/2009/10/19/birthday-sale-results/ They sold 80k copies, and ~8% of the people who bought it said they were pirates going clean. Also some anecdotal evidence, but that isn't really cool. I often go legit if I like a game, especially if its only a few bucks
DaveW wrote: As for the suggestion that piracy on the PC is not ridiculously more widespread than on consoles, well, I can't believe you're serious. Type "Modern Warfare 2" into a well known torrent site, for example, and 1000 people are seeding the PC version. The highest seeded 360 version is 300. PS3 is 30.
That is not what I meant. Was only talking about how damaging an early leak would be dependent on which platform it was. It's a shame nobody keeps stats over amount of seeders/time, would be interesting in relation to this to see how much the seeder/leecher count has declined since the release for the different platforms.
Jonas wrote: Did I claim the average console gamer is incapable of researching piracy and learning how to do it? No. I claimed there's far more console gamers who've never pirated software than there are PC gamers, and I stand by that. Realise that there are people out there who purchase pirated games. Realise that the Madden, FIFA, and NHL/NFL/NBA/ACRONYM games actually sell, in great numbers, on an annual basis, to people who are so far removed from what you might consider "gamers" as to essentially be a whole other species of consumer.
You said there were less people who knew how to do it, but since googling this info is so ridiculously easy I can only assume it was some sort of statement as to the inability to google or or follow simple instructions :/. That's how I read it anyway.
Jonas wrote: Even though you wrote "even as someone who uses the term consoletards at times", I find your taking offense to be hilariously hypocritical! :lol:
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Jonas wrote: There's also the question of multiplayer of course. If you pirate a multiplayer PC game you can often get it working on a fake LAN with Hamachi. If you pirate a console game you can forget about the multiplayer.
This is true, but Hamachi only supports 16 players unless you pay, so it won't be a true multiplayer experience for a lot of games, but the big ones like MW2 probably have pirate servers anyway, so I guess its kinda moot.
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Re: Deus Ex 3 - I'll just leave this here

Post by VectorM »

DaveW wrote:I don't know where on earth you're getitng any of that information.
His Uber Perception powers allow him to see magical statistics.
As someone who pirates essentially all his games except multiplayer titles I want to play (Killing Floor, Left 4 Dead 2 etc.) I don't take Steam sales as a chance to 'go legit' at any point
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