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Is it true new Deus Ex:MD split into two games? 
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Post Re: Is it true new Deus Ex:MD split into two games?
Seems like the game has received quite the mixed reception.

So what's the verdict around here on this forum?

Ignoring the "projecting America's social issues in half-metaphorical form on everyone" factor, is it actually a worthy Deus Ex game that's actually a part of the lore, and not just a cyberpunk game given a DX overcoating? And are there any references to DXN in it (just like DX:HR had to TNM)?

Answers to these questions are crucial to me before I'm going to check the game out. Even though I've already bought it. But I'm also very lazy if I haven't got an initiative for something.

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Post Re: Is it true new Deus Ex:MD split into two games?
FastGamerr wrote:
Seems like the game has received quite the mixed reception.

So what's the verdict around here on this forum?

Ignoring the "projecting America's social issues in half-metaphorical form on everyone" factor, is it actually a worthy Deus Ex game that's actually a part of the lore, and not just a cyberpunk game given a DX overcoating? And are there any references to DXN in it (just like DX:HR had to TNM)?

Answers to these questions are crucial to me before I'm going to check the game out. Even though I've already bought it. But I'm also very lazy if I haven't got an initiative for something.


How about you tell us? ;) Play it and tell us your opinion, sacrifice a little of your time for us

But in all honesty side missions are more fun than main mission, they changed Bob Page's hair to black for f*ck sake(it was orange in HR) and the black and yellow theme they established in HR is kinda there but not at same time, it's like they afraid of fully dedicating their game to one art style

Oh and anyone bothered by fade to black every time when you try to talk to someone or camera control is taken away from you


Sun Sep 04, 2016 12:48 am
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Post Re: Is it true new Deus Ex:MD split into two games?
LordCorvin wrote:
How about you tell us? ;) Play it and tell us your opinion, sacrifice a little of your time for us


:< I really miss the times when I had free time and could just boot up a game and play it like mad.

But yeah, the side missions being better than the main one actually sounds pretty good to me, because I knew that DX:HR had it going when I actually felt like doing the sidequests (in DX:IW I couldn't give any crap to any of the sidequests: coffee shop shenanigans etc.).

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Post Re: Is it true new Deus Ex:MD split into two games?
FastGamerr wrote:
Seems like the game has received quite the mixed reception.

So what's the verdict around here on this forum?

Ignoring the "projecting America's social issues in half-metaphorical form on everyone" factor, is it actually a worthy Deus Ex game that's actually a part of the lore, and not just a cyberpunk game given a DX overcoating? And are there any references to DXN in it (just like DX:HR had to TNM)?

Answers to these questions are crucial to me before I'm going to check the game out. Even though I've already bought it. But I'm also very lazy if I haven't got an initiative for something.

It's Human Revolution with more stuff.

Nein more, nein less.

Same amount of awkward and unnecessary origin storying too.

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Post Re: Is it true new Deus Ex:MD split into two games?
I finished it just now. Steam says it took me 45 hours, which is almost 50% longer than it took me to get through DXHR the first time around. I did explore a lot though - pretty sure no apartments in Prague remain unburglarised. A conservative estimate would be that it should take about as long to play through Mankind Divided as it did to play through Human Revolution.

Most of the flaws from HR are still there - the biased skillpoint system has only gotten slightly less biased, weapon mods are even less interesting than in HR, and Mankind Divided only has marginally more choice and consequence in the aug system than HR did (it's harder to max out in this game because there are more augs, but what feels like the same amount of Praxis points). I do think one of my main gripes (the CASIE aug and its ridiculously drama-annihilating pheromones) has been adequately addressed though - at least the couple of times I managed to try the CASIE aug in MD, I didn't feel like I'd missed out on anything because I used it - it didn't feel lame anymore.

What HR did well, MD does even better. The levels all seem even bigger and more open, the gunplay is more fun, the cover system is a little slicker, and the hub seems to be about as dense as both of the HR hubs combined. You do kind of lose out on the globe-trotting feel since Prague remains your base of operations throughout, but that hub is so damn well done I would forgive them for any cost of making it what it is.

Now, the story.

Yeah it's... it could be better. I like that there are essentially two parallel questlines, so you kind of feel like a double agent, but it remains completely unestablished how this situation came to pass. It feels like there was supposed to be another game between HR and MD - I mean there's stories that start in medias res, and then there's stories that start half-way into the plot. This feels like the latter.

I liked the ending. It's true that it definitely feels like it's building up to a sequel - I've heard they've been working on the sequel in parallel with MD, and I wouldn't be surprised if it's released pretty soon, but to be honest I'll be happy if I don't have to wait another 5 years for the next Deus Ex game. However the final mission was excellently designed and executed, the encounter with the Big Bad Evil Guy was very well done, in fact both "boss fights" in this game were really good (I put them in quotations because I didn't actually fight in either of them), and I feel like all the major threads got tied off pretty nicely. They broke Chekov's Gun a few times*, which put me a bit off, but it wasn't something that ruined the story in any way.

I do wonder what the hell was up with the final choice, though. You even have to select whether to save Brown and the other guests or go after Marchenko, yet on my way to Marchenko I ended up stumbling into the party and saving Brown anyway, and then immediately reaching Marchenko, achieving both objectives at the same time. I have no idea what that was about.

Overall I'd say it doesn't feel like the game was split in two - it does feel like it was deliberately made with a sequel in mind, but that's par for the course with franchises this big. The "in app purchases" didn't bother me either, though I understand why it would make people angry - I never bought anything, and I had a good time. It's sort of philosophically upsetting that a system like that even exists in a Deus Ex game, but it really doesn't feel like it was ever intended to be there, so you're free to ignore it at no consequence to your enjoyment of the game.

My only substantial gripe with Mankind Divided, and admittedly this is a big one that may make or break the experience for a lesser fan, is the Desperate Measures pre-order bonus content. That is so obviously a storyline mission they've cut from the main game in order to make it a pre-order exclusive. I admit I didn't notice anything missing when I was playing the game, but holy shit it's obvious when you play Desperate Measures that it belongs in there. They straight up took that shit out of the game and made it a stand-alone, meaning the game itself now has slightly less content, and this mission is necessarily experienced out of context. You don't even get to play it at the time in the story where it belongs, so they reset your augs and your inventory, they teleport you around because the content apparently can't use the Prague hub, and it's bookended by the most awkward recap. "Jensen! Remember that bombing you were in?" "You're joking, right?" Yeah, Square Enix... you're joking... right?

So yeah. Square Enix are assholes, but Eidos Montreal did a damn good job. Probably play the game if you like Deus Ex. Definitely play the game if you like Human Revolution.

* Tiny spoiler: Why did the Orchid Neutralizing Enzyme never have a use? That seemed like a super important item to have, and yet it never became relevant.

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Post Re: Is it true new Deus Ex:MD split into two games?
Jonas wrote:
So yeah. Square Enix are assholes, but Eidos Montreal did a damn good job. Probably play the game if you like Deus Ex. Definitely play the game if you like Human Revolution.


I love Deus Ex, but couldn't stand Human Revolution. Square Enix's repulsive business practices aside (microtransactions in a SP game, main storyline content cut and sold separately, pre-order bonuses, gah!), if it's just Human Revolution Redux, I'm going to pass this time and pray the Deus Ex property ends up in somebody else's hands one day.


Sun Sep 04, 2016 7:37 pm
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Post Re: Is it true new Deus Ex:MD split into two games?
Jonas wrote:
Tiny spoiler: Why did the Orchid Neutralizing Enzyme never have a use? That seemed like a super important item to have, and yet it never became relevant.

It has a super secret use in the final mission : You can save Miller by talking to him again...

Jonas wrote:
I do wonder what the hell was up with the final choice, though. You even have to select whether to save Brown and the other guests or go after Marchenko, yet on my way to Marchenko I ended up stumbling into the party and saving Brown anyway, and then immediately reaching Marchenko, achieving both objectives at the same time. I have no idea what that was about.

Emergent gameplay? What really annoys me is that they pull the same shit earlier in the game with the bank/church but there you *can't* do both. I hate it when games establish a rule like that and then break it without telling me. It's especially weird since, as you say, the distance between the two objectives is like 20 seconds of walking.

Jonas wrote:
Yeah it's... it could be better. I like that there are essentially two parallel questlines, so you kind of feel like a double agent, but it remains completely unestablished how this situation came to pass. It feels like there was supposed to be another game between HR and MD - I mean there's stories that start in medias res, and then there's stories that start half-way into the plot. This feels like the latter.

Not to mention the fact that Jensen's new aug questions never get resolved (the quest literally just ends. I assumed I had fucked up and missed something and looked online, but nope, that's just how it ends). We do learn that Jensen was personally put into position by Manderley. That and some other hints make it pretty clear to me that Jensen is an unwitting triple agent meant to take down Juggernaut from the inside.

Jonas wrote:
Most of the flaws from HR are still there - the biased skillpoint system has only gotten slightly less biased, weapon mods are even less interesting than in HR, and Mankind Divided only has marginally more choice and consequence in the aug system than HR did

I like the fact that for half the game, enabling the new augs comes at a penalty of either disabling an old aug or suffering some graphical glitches. They're pretty tame though, so can probably just be ignored. Neat thought though.

Jonas wrote:
What HR did well, MD does even better. The levels all seem even bigger and more open, the gunplay is more fun, the cover system is a little slicker, and the hub seems to be about as dense as both of the HR hubs combined. You do kind of lose out on the globe-trotting feel since Prague remains your base of operations throughout, but that hub is so damn well done I would forgive them for any cost of making it what it is.

I don't really agree here. I'll admit my memory of HR is very fuzzy at this point (one playthrough 5 years ago is not a solid foundation for remembrance) but I think level design is about the same, slightly more open perhaps, but its still very much START HERE ----->>> GO HERE rather than circular levels with a lot of stuff to miss (but the "corridors" are very wide so there is still plenty to miss, I'll give them that). The bank level was very cool though.

Prague didn't really work for me I think. I like it as a hub, its just that multiple smaller hubs gel better with my playstyle. Otherwise I just do the whole damn hub first, then have only story missions and then updated hub (which really only adds a few sidequests and they're basically all handed to you via infolink...). For example I did the whole southern part of the map before fixing my augs. Clearly stupid buuuut.
I also don't like it when I go to a location, and there's obviously nothing there but its much too elaborate so you just know its story/quest location later. Same goes with stealing the water report from the bank, don't like it when quest items just magically appear because I happen to have the quest now.

Jonas wrote:
he encounter with the Big Bad Evil Guy was very well done, in fact both "boss fights" in this game were really good (I put them in quotations because I didn't actually fight in either of them)

Which is the first one supposed to be? I legit do not know what you refer too.

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Tue Sep 06, 2016 7:53 pm
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Post Re: Is it true new Deus Ex:MD split into two games?
Jaedar wrote:
It has a super secret use in the final mission : You can save Miller by talking to him again...

Oh. Guess I should've done that then :S

Jaedar wrote:
We do learn that Jensen was personally put into position by Manderley. That and some other hints make it pretty clear to me that Jensen is an unwitting triple agent meant to take down Juggernaut from the inside.

Oh, yeah I think the extra conversation between Lucius DeBeers and that psychologist woman in the post-credits cutscene makes it pretty clear that's what's going on. That's basically the resolution to that questline as far as I'm concerned.

Jaedar wrote:
I like the fact that for half the game, enabling the new augs comes at a penalty of either disabling an old aug or suffering some graphical glitches. They're pretty tame though, so can probably just be ignored. Neat thought though.

Yeah I liked that too, it's too bad it gets negated after a while. I've seen a video of what happens if you achieve full "overclock", the game actually gives you a massive glitch and then disables one of your augs at random, which is pretty cool :lol:

Jaedar wrote:
I also don't like it when I go to a location, and there's obviously nothing there but its much too elaborate so you just know its story/quest location later. Same goes with stealing the water report from the bank, don't like it when quest items just magically appear because I happen to have the quest now.

I agree about things just magically appearing - I get why they do that, it's because it's a surprising amount of extra work to account for players completing quests before they get them (trust me on this, and btw infinite kudos to The Witcher 3 for doing this all the time) - but it definitely feels like a failure to reward you for being curious and exploring things out of order. However, I do quite like having the ability to go in and scout an area before it becomes a mission location, because you can do a lot of cool shit when you know the layout ahead of time. It feels like casing a joint before a break-in - preparation pays, you know?

Jaedar wrote:
Which is the first one supposed to be? I legit do not know what you refer too.

Daria in the Harvester side quest. I just talked her down of course, but she's just as much a boss fight as Marchenko.

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Post Re: Is it true new Deus Ex:MD split into two games?
Jonas wrote:
Yeah I liked that too, it's too bad it gets negated after a while. I've seen a video of what happens if you achieve full "overclock", the game actually gives you a massive glitch and then disables one of your augs at random, which is pretty cool :lol:

Guess I didn't play long enough with high overclock for this to happen.

I don't mind getting the ability to undo one or two disables, but removing all of them feels a bit cheap.

Jonas wrote:
It feels like casing a joint before a break-in - preparation pays, you know?

Except for the fact that it's basically psychic preparation?

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Wed Sep 07, 2016 4:24 pm
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Post Re: Is it true new Deus Ex:MD split into two games?
How is it psychic? You're in this new town, you spend some time just wandering around and getting familiar with it, you find some interesting places of possible tactical use in the future, and you check them out. I get what you mean I guess, but that's not how it feels to me.

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Post Re: Is it true new Deus Ex:MD split into two games?
Jonas wrote:
How is it psychic? You're in this new town, you spend some time just wandering around and getting familiar with it, you find some interesting places of possible tactical use in the future, and you check them out. I get what you mean I guess, but that's not how it feels to me.

What I mean is that casing a joint only works if you know you'll go there. It breaks the whole illusion of the gameworld otherwise. Clearly Prague isn't just the three blocks we see in game, and clearly cities aren't constructed in closed curves so the only way out is subway or chopper. And sometimes it works, vega in limb clinic for instance. But for me, it doesn't work.

The tourism office is just so madly out of place it breaks the whole illusion. It's neat, has power, an escape route... so why haven't the homeless/refugees claimed it? Not to mention the array of 6 computer monitors just sitting there in an otherwise bombed out place.

Same with the paper you steal from the bank. It's not one file amongst thousands that I have no reason to dig through, it's clearly something of interest and who the fuck put it there when the rest of the bank is knocked out?

At least a magically locked door sort of explains why no one else went there.

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