BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

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Jonas
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BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

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DDL
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Re: BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

Post by DDL »

I love some of the comments:
I can’t agree, however, with what seems to be shafting permanent choices and consequences into an optional mode. Of course, it’s largely guesswork what said choices and consequences will be, but if these are tied to the main narrative, I’ll have a pass. Irrational: if you believe your ideas of choice and consequence are good, and that they provide for a unique experience in regards to how the game is played, don’t shove them into an optional mode. Run with them from the start. I want to be challenged by your design and ideas, no matter how aggressive or anti-current gaming climate of player grooming they may be. Yes, many developers in the industry have only seen one movie or read one book; but don’t be the studio that only played one game.
"We don't just want you to pander to us, we actively want you to stop pandering to everyone else!!!111 :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: "


Fucksake. :roll:
AEmer
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Re: BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

Post by AEmer »

I'm willing to bet that none of the people here clamoring for a feature like this will actually complete the game on this mode without consulting a guide or starting the game on another mode first.

Not a lot, mind you, but I'd be willing to put a hundred bucks down.
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Re: BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

Post by Hassat Hunter »

I'd be surprised if this difficulty mode is as SS2 was.

Because I've heard stuff like this before... and the games generally weren't that hard at all still.
Also, Aemer, I am willing to do such. Just buy me the game on launch day and another $50,- game I want... and you'll see me do it. Otherwise I will wait till the price-drop, as I always do ;).
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Jaedar
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Re: BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

Post by Jaedar »

DDL wrote: "We don't just want you to pander to us, we actively want you to stop pandering to everyone else!!!111 :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: "
.... I really dunno what to say. See, I started with something kind of offensive but I don't get what your problem with that comment is. The guy thinks your narrative choices should be permanent in all game modes. You think KOTOR would be better if you could go full evil the entire game, force zaalbar to kill mission and then 3 seconds before the game go full light side and resurrect mission? Cause that's what he's saying shouldn't happen.
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AEmer wrote: I'm willing to bet that none of the people here clamoring for a feature like this will actually complete the game on this mode without consulting a guide or starting the game on another mode first.
If I wind up getting this game, I will remember this. I Find your lack of faith disturbing.
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DDL
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Re: BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

Post by DDL »

Oh fucking grow up.

This isn't KOTOR, and anyway your example is nonsensical and massively retarded. A better example would be "play massively darkside and then at the last moment try to turn bastila back to the light and thus suddenly swing hugely to the lightside", because A)that doesn't introduce idiotic resurrections, and B)you can actually do that in the game anyway.

This, on the other hand, is a bioshock game, so by permanent choices they are referring at least in part, and possibly mostly in full, to things like skills and plasmids and so on. Things you were able to freely switch round in the first game (possibly the second? Haven't played it).

It's not enough, apparently, to have a mode coded up purely to allow all the OMG OMG PERMANENT CHOICES AND CONSEQUENCES OR MAH LIEF IS TEH MAENINGLESS crowd to live out their "lasting regret" fantasies, he's specifically demanding that they also force that mode on everyone who DOESN'T want that sort of fixed-consequence gameplay. Which is fucking stupid. Incredibly fucking stupid.

Also, totally unable to grasp the concept of "optional".
"I want to be challenged by your design and ideas"
-THEN ENABLE THAT FUCKING MODE, YOU UTTER MORON

It just seems ludicrous that the moment a company bends over backwards to accommodate the frothing NMAers of the bioshock world, one of them demands they also deny "non-frothy casual gameplay" to anyone who doesn't want all this HARD CHOICES shit.
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Re: BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

Post by Jaedar »

DDL wrote:
This isn't KOTOR, and anyway your example is nonsensical and massively retarded. A better example would be "play massively darkside and then at the last moment try to turn bastila back to the light and thus suddenly swing hugely to the lightside", because A)that doesn't introduce idiotic resurrections, and B)you can actually do that in the game anyway.
No my example is what happens when you have non-permanent choices that can be changed any time. I'm glad we agree that it would be massively retarded.

DDL wrote:
This, on the other hand, is a bioshock game, so by permanent choices they are referring at least in part, and possibly mostly in full, to things like skills and plasmids and so on. Things you were able to freely switch round in the first game (possibly the second? Haven't played it).
Yes but making those permanent for all difficulties isn't what the poster in question wanted. At least not the way I read his post. He only seemed to say that non permanent narrative choice=bad and that their permanence should be forced.
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Re: BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

Post by DDL »

So really ALL you're arguing about is the bioshock equivalent of whether mission should stay dead or not? Other than that you see no real problem with having gigantic morality switches at the drop of a hat, as long as permanent things stay permanent?

Because I'm pretty sure we could get down into some ludicrous semantic detail here if we really tried.

But fuck it. Let's assume that what you've taken from his statement is the entirety of his intention, and that he simply wants all narrative choices to be permanent. That's fine. What I object to is the following:

It should be forced on in all modes.
For everyone.
Even those who don't want that.

I can see absolutely no reason ever, EVER, to remove options from games. Adding options? Sure. Fuck, I'm all about the whole "well you can play it this way but you don't have to", but anything that says "yeah we did have that, but we thought nah, fuck it: DO IT THIS WAY AND NO OTHER WAY"...is just pointless for the sake of pointlessness. Always give you audience more options if you can.
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Re: BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

Post by Jonas »

God damnit.
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Jaedar
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Re: BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

Post by Jaedar »

DDL wrote:Other than that you see no real problem with having gigantic morality switches at the drop of a hat, as long as permanent things stay permanent?
I kind of do, but that's not what I was arguing about.

Well DDL, see I think that a choice which can be retconned whenever isn't really a good choice. Because there's no way you can build any real consequences around that if you have to be able to change everything at the drop of a hat and a choice with no real consequences is just flavor. There's other reasons as well, but that's a pretty major one.

I am pretty sure I've argued along these lines before on this forum so I don't really see much point in doing it again. Don't even know why I decided to defend some random internet commentator.
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Re: BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

Post by bobby 55 »

Erm, it's not compulsory to play 1999 mode. Those who are up for it, go get 'em. :P

I'm still trying to get my mind around Elizabeth, and I'll stick to Normal difficulty.
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Re: BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

Post by gamer0004 »

Seriously people? How can anyone be opposed to this? I'll take more complexity and choice any day of the week, but seriously how can anyone be opposed to offering the choice to gamers? People who don't like it don't get it, people who like it get it. Everybody wins.
(And without making this optional this feature probably wouldn't have made it at all, because those who like more complexity are a minority and are thus not financially attractive to cater to for AAA developers).
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Re: BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

Post by AEmer »

@Hassat
I'll wait till the price drop then. Besides, I can't actually bet with anyone intending to play this way; it would change the circumstances of the bet.

@Darth Jaedar
Please don't choke me! Also, I hope you will remember it ;-) I want to see if I'm right.

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Re: BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

Post by Hassat Hunter »

Well, BioShock 2 is still sitting here in plastic... so it's going to take a while. Too much things on Steam and GOG that interest me more...
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Re: BioShock Infinite's 1999 Mode

Post by Jonas »

Mmmmmmmmmmmmmm BioShock 2. Those Little Sister defence sequences. Soooooo well designed.
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