What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

UFOs, lost socks, discuss whatever you like here.

Moderators: Master_Kale, TNM Team

User avatar
Jaedar
Illuminati
Posts: 3937
Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2009 3:01 pm
Location: Terra, Sweden, Uppsala.

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by Jaedar »

AEmer wrote:It looks like you can't get enough war assets without playing either multiplayer or the iphone game to get the "best" endings. Which is uh...I'm not actually sure.

Part of me is giddy that software pirates can't get the best ending, and I kindof like the attempt to integrate more into the experience than just the standard game...I like where it's going, and I think it's original...

But it's probably a bad decision.
The fact that you can't get the best ending in a single player game without playing multiplayer is pretty dumb. As for software pirates..... give it a few weeks and I'm sure there'll be a savegame editor or such out. People made one to avoid grinding minerals in me2, they'll make one to not have to grind war assets. and if not... hey there's always youtube.


And in general: give me a way to play the game legally without installing spyware and I'll take it. Till then.
(Seriously, fuck origin)
"Delays are temporary; mediocrity is forever."
odio ergo sum
DDL
Traditional Evil Scientist
Traditional Evil Scientist
Posts: 3791
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2005 10:03 am

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by DDL »

I with jaedar on this one: I'm super keen to play it, but I can wait. Ideally till it's cheap + all DLC. And on steam.

I know steam is also basically spyware, but y'know: it's already on my machine.


AEmer: regarding the whole Jack issue, you're clearly not alone: there's a lot of Jack-love out there, which I still find amazing. I found her to be a relentlessly negative, irredeemably childish waste of crewspace (and, I'm honest/shallow enough to admit, also terrible terrible eye candy). Even doing your level best to make her feel welcome (and thus less unbearable) seemed to be essentially futile. If they'd added an interrupt to let you slap her super hard and shout "THE UNIVERSE IS A HORRIBLE PLACE, NOW GROW THE FUCK UP", that might've helped. Also, I never found her terribly useful in combat (though this could be due to me simply not using her very much).
I'm a lazy, lazy player -and I can't concentrate on pausecombat AND shoot people AND deal with the ludicrous multifunction keybinds they love so much-, so I rarely manually activated squadmate powers (other than the obvious post-arrival "FFFS GARRUS, YOU HAVE AMMO POWERS, USE THEM -_-"), perhaps she simply needed a more guided employment to shine as a combatmonkey?

Also, from a realism point, wearing nothing but tattoos into battle may look awesome if you're like..five (see, told you she was childish), but I'd stick on a suit of magical futuretech armour too, since y'know: they have those in Mass Effect. Biotics may stop bullets hitting you, but so do suit-mounted shields. Eventually both systems will fuck up briefly, and then you have a big leaky hole in you whereas my magic armour suit is plugging me with coagulants and local anaesthetics. And ice-cold dutch lager. What, tattoos don't do that? Who knew...

So yeah, SLAP, GROW UP, WEAR THIS, FFS. That might've helped.

Interesting idea to parallel her with Miranda, though. Still, at least with Miranda you know you can have a damn conversation without death threats. Or at least, without overt ones. And Miranda was...guidable: you get the impression she'd actually listen to an argument and then judge accordingly, rather than shouting "FUCK YOU YOU'RE NOT MY REAL MUM" and hiding in the basement.
I guess the fact that TIM apparently thought Jack would be useful always struck me as hugely out of character (he strikes me as someone who knows when to hold 'em or fold 'em): she's clearly useless for anything save as a test subject for future research, or as a "unguided missile". If I'd been TIM and I was super keen to actually use her rather than let her sit around in stupid spaceprison, I would've just dropped her on a planet I didn't like and then run away. Let her burn out, taking everything with her.


I think mostly though, I just liked the peeps from Normandy 1 more. Plus I've always kinda liked the idea that Tali was some gentle naive ingenue that I basically collected, handed a shotgun, and made murder hundreds upon hundreds of people.

"How's that pilgrimage working out?"

"The horror. The horror."

"Nice!" *brofist*

Aaaannyway. So this multiplayer: does it absolutely totally need other players, or can you use bots? Because otherwise, wtf is going to happen to people replaying the game in five years' time?
User avatar
Jaedar
Illuminati
Posts: 3937
Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2009 3:01 pm
Location: Terra, Sweden, Uppsala.

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by Jaedar »

I liked 1 person from Normandy SR1, and 2 people from SR2. SR2 is thus twice as good.

And hey, I like no one on SR2 mark 2... so.... yeah. Me3 is weird.
"Delays are temporary; mediocrity is forever."
odio ergo sum
DDL
Traditional Evil Scientist
Traditional Evil Scientist
Posts: 3791
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2005 10:03 am

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by DDL »

Who who and who? (minus ME3 spoilers, I guess)

Am always curious to see how people's feelings differ from mine (even though clearly if they differ from mine they must be wrong, because I'm amazing).
bobby 55
Illuminati
Posts: 6354
Joined: Wed Jun 24, 2009 9:15 am
Location: Brisbane Australia

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by bobby 55 »

Apart from Mordin, Legion, and Garrus I'd say the ME 1 crew are more likeable. I like Liara more in 2 though.

Um, I thought I read in a non spoilery ME 3 review that to get the "good endings" you had to import an ME 2 save. Also the game (apart from fan service) was better with the saves being used as well. I guess I'll find out when I get to play.
Last edited by bobby 55 on Fri Mar 09, 2012 6:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Growing old is inevitable.......Growing up is optional
User avatar
Jaedar
Illuminati
Posts: 3937
Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2009 3:01 pm
Location: Terra, Sweden, Uppsala.

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by Jaedar »

I liked tali in ME1, legion and mordin in ME2. everyone else was meh or I don't like you.

Fine bioware, you win. I am successfully emotionally engaged now.
Spoilers for tuchanka:
I Had to kill mordin. :( Had to be done. Love that they made you pull the trigger yourself.
"Delays are temporary; mediocrity is forever."
odio ergo sum
AEmer
Illuminati
Posts: 1490
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2007 12:04 am

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by AEmer »

@ DDL, I already had the thought on replays being an issue under this system back in the first post of this thread.

I don't envision replaying ME3 more than twice...so a total of 3 playthroughs, probably...but I'm already looking forward to my renegade playthrough, even though I'm not done with the paragon one.
I just like how angry paragon shepard is. In my playthrough she's the super dense, coalesced embodiment of all anger from everywhere ever.

I also don't see why there wouldn't be bots, but I don't know that there are, and there's always the possibility of a hack, as Jaedar mentions...except when you're not on PC. It may even be tricky on PC, probably requiring a memory hack.

The game is big enough that it's probably not going to be an issue to find players for 10 years or so, if you put in a bit of work, but beyond that, who knows. As I said, it's probably a mistake, but an original thought at least.

@ As for Jack...well the point is, I guess, that her biotic barrier is so powerful that she never gets hurt. She IS the most powerful biotic ever. I suppose I also liked her because of how angry she was at everything. I have a soft spot for really angry people, apparently.

Also, if you romance Jack, you kindof mend her. I mean...never stick your dick in crazy and all that, but in ME2, I actually kindof prostituted my Shepard the first time. Of the RI's I wanted Jack the least, but she seemed like the one who needed someone to love her the most to be stable enough for the suicide mission...after completion I instantly replayed with a Tali romance instead, found that it made no difference, and settled with that as my canon playthrough. Anyway, I didn't find her to be an annoying prick, though I did feel like a father popping by and doing his daughters dirty dishes because she couldn't even manage that level of order in her life. Which was fine. The fact that she's thoroughly broken makes her slightly endearing, and above all else, she's a different NPC from the norm.

But yeah, I almost never used her on missions. Being an adept and my PC being an adept too, she would be completely useless, because everybody and their mom has armor on hardcore in ME2...Even husks. I pretty much needed infiltrator/soldier/engineer squadmates.

@ Jaedar re: you spoiler (so it's safe for you to read)

Yeah, bioware are assholes like that, but it does make the game damn good. It was a great exit, and it actually didn't feel forced that shepard should get that choice...

And honestly, putting Ashley/Kaidan in the hospital, while it was obviously forced (I tried every goddamn power on my team as I chased that mech), it was a good thing. I liked visiting someone in the hospital. It felt good.


@ Origin
My only issue with Origin is that it's another thing in addition to steam, but honestly, it's not that bad. It seems to be very lightweight, it performs very well, and the DLC mechanic is much better integrated than it is in Steam. ME3 doesn't rely on games for windows live either. So long as it doesn't install a rootkit, I'll probably be ok with it spying on me, too.

Plus, if you like the steam overlay, you can just run origin through steam. Then you have access to two overlays at the same time. Yay! :D
AEmer
Illuminati
Posts: 1490
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2007 12:04 am

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by AEmer »

@ Mr Cyberpunk
This doesn't include anything his spoiler didn't. Also, that picture you link is nasty, yo.
I get what you're saying...but Bioware was clearly aware of the issue; there's lampshade hangings in multiple places in the game, and while that doesn't really solve anything, it means this was designed by choice, not by unwitting design. The picture itself is a dumb decision - sourcing it from a royalty free image shouldn't have happened, they should taken Liz Sroka out for a photoshoot themselves somewhere and then modded that up if they wanted that type of image...but who knows if they already did that, and went with this because it ended up being better?

Ultimately, the image is good, you get to see her face in the game, and it kindof works out. If someone rips the 3d model and uses the information from the image to design an unmasked Tali, we'll be able to see whether Bioware made the right decision, but I'm withholding judgement there...and right know, I'm actually pretty happy with what they've done.
User avatar
Jaedar
Illuminati
Posts: 3937
Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2009 3:01 pm
Location: Terra, Sweden, Uppsala.

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by Jaedar »

@Aemer: same spoilers as before.
I did not like the hospitalizing. It felt way too forced. First Eva is immune to all biotics, tech attacks, and her shield has 0 regeneration cooldown and goes up faster than everything else. Then when she grabs ash/kaid there's still no renegade interrupt to take the shot, despite eva standing between you and kaid/ash.

To me, it just felt horribly forced and did not make me care at all, because I had no input in the matter. Killing mordin otoh: I chose to do that, I pulled the trigger. That's what makes it so good


this thread is gonna turn into a classified military document soon :mrgreen:
"Delays are temporary; mediocrity is forever."
odio ergo sum
AEmer
Illuminati
Posts: 1490
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2007 12:04 am

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by AEmer »

@ Jaedar: Yeah, I understand what you're saying. I just enjoyed where the story ended up going as a result, but you're right about the encounter itself.

@ Thread

http://social.bioware.com/forum/Mass-Ef ... 444-1.html

This is a Bioware post explaining how the stats of mass effect 3 work. Being something of a game rules nerd, it really bugged me that I didn't know these details. Indulge me in a bit of powergaming theory, if you will, as I try to spell out what this game system means:
See, ME3 has a really cool but also peculiar system for weapons: You can choose whatever gun you want to bring on a mission, but your guns have weight.
You can basically bring as many guns as you want, but you'll get a weight penalty in the shape of higher power cooldown. If you bring fewer weapons, you get a bonus.

I wanted to link this because I've been searching for this information for a while, and there's some intricacies to it.

I've been using the lightest assault rifle and the hardest-hitting heavy pistol for a while now; the combination weighs in at almost nothing, giving me a supposed 190% cooldown reduction. Add to that, I'm using a suit of armor that gives tremendous cooldown reduction, most of my powers provide cooldown reduction, and so on.

A power with a 10 second cooldown as standard probably has around 2 seconds cooldown for me, because I have around 400% cooldown reduction total. To get that down to 1 second, I would need another 500% cooldown reduction.

Clearly there's diminishing returns at work; a 200% cooldown reduction puts me at 3 seconds. Of course, the other way to look at it is in terms of extra power uses per. 10 seconds. 200% cooldown reduction, which is what you get from having a light load (think a handgun and a submachine gun, or a single assault rifle) provides you with 3 power uses in 10 seconds. 400% cooldown reduction provides you with 5 power uses in 10 seconds. 900% cooldown reduction provides you with 10 power uses in 10 seconds.

You can clearly see that every 100% of added cooldown reduction gives you an extra use of the power within the powers standard cooldown timer. In other words, your power-dps scales linearly with cooldown reduction. I'll report back when I can test in game, but if the bioware post is correct, your squadmembers cooldown reduction will be based off of shepards cooldown reduction. If true, that's all sorts of cruel: You can raise your squadmembers dps tremendously with cooldown reduction to your own character, but you can't raise their weapon damage in the same fashion.

The power damage formula, on the other hand, is much simpler..but power damage boosts are much less readily available. It shouldn't be difficult to find about 100% power damage bonus, which will effectively double the power damage, while only sacrificing about 100% cooldown reduction bonus. That'll double your DPS for a linear reduction, so it's probably worth it to get between 50% and 100%, though, again, if you also lose squadmate power uses, it'll be tricky to find out the optimum combination.

Anyway, here's what all this means:

If you want to be a powerhouse in ME3 on the higher difficulty levels, you need to cherry pick your team for the missions, you want massive cooldown reduction on your skills, and you'll want to choose some relatively crappy lightweight weapons. The good news is that this is an incredibly flashy and pretty exciting gameplay style in this game, the bad news is that all those pretty weapons? Not gonna be useful to you.

And believe me, there's a metric fuckton of cool weapons in this game, so that's pretty sad. That's actually what prompted me to go on this tirade...I was annoyed at having a much harder time playing around with the cool toys, and wanted to figure out why. For my soldier-playthrough, I'm definitely reducing the difficulty level so I won't feel as much pain from gimping myself by trying a different, more weapons-heavy type of build.
Mr_Cyberpunk
Illuminati
Posts: 3441
Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2005 3:57 am
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Contact:

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by Mr_Cyberpunk »

sourcing it from a royalty free image shouldn't have happened, they should taken Liz Sroka out for a photoshoot themselves somewhere and then modded that up if they wanted that type of image...but who knows if they already did that, and went with this because it ended up being better?
Exactly, its not like Liz Sroka wasn't availible, and in all honesty I always saw her as the real face of Tali. I'm going to have to argue a need to mod her portfolio photos in. I bet this is probably the first thing that does get modded.

On another note I tried to bring myself to play Mass Effect 2, Good lord that game sucked. From what I've seen so far of Mass Effect 3 there's some major improvements in terms of the skills system and overall combat mechanics- though the lip syncing is still as bugged as it was in ME2. But already I'm seeing a lot of improvements over ME2.. ME2 was an ass of a game, especially from a writing standpoint (I hated being Cerberus' lackey for so much of the game.. thats why its off putting to have to play through it again. Because Cerberus suck.)

I'm going to probably have to give the entire trilogy a proper playthrough since it appears more of the effects from ME1 impact a lot heavier on ME3, same with ME2 to ME3 as well. So that warrants another go through of the entire series.

Definately some redeeming qualities in this one. So we'll see how this goes. Sadly I have to start ME3 on the default shep as I've not had the time to go through the other two games- and in all fairness I should really be working on my UV maps right now LOL.
AEmer
Illuminati
Posts: 1490
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2007 12:04 am

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by AEmer »

re: the spoilery part
When I didn't know it was a stock photo...the detail level is severely limited on the ingame photo, and it's very tricky to make out the details...but I did see she only had 3 fingers and didn't think her hand was shopped, because I couldn't even tell if it was a hyperrealistic drawing or an edited photo. Bioware hired on an artist doing hyperrealistic ME2 art, and this somewhat fit that style. I'm just happy Tali turned out to be pretty =P

And, heh, well I can't recommend playing it as default Shepard. I would recommend getting yourself an ME2 Savegame, though getting one that matches your exacting specifications could be tricky at this point - much trickier than an ME1 savegame.

In particular, ME3 actually acts on what ME2 DLC you've played...For example, I got a reaction on not having played the firewalker DLC, though the impact of that was probably pretty small (the only ME2 dlc I didn't get around to).
User avatar
VectorM
MJ12
Posts: 320
Joined: Tue Jun 22, 2010 6:05 pm

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by VectorM »

To get the "best" ending, you need 5000 military strenght/galactic readiness/whatever. From the single player only, you can definitely get more than 6000. I have a friend who hasn't played a second of the multiplayer and he has over 6000 already and is 80% in to the main campaign.

So, no, you don't need to play the multiplayer for the best ending. You might have to get out of your way to do most of the quests, perhaps, and it will be easier to get it if you do play the multi, but you definitely don't NEED it at all.

Then again, the entire thing is pretty confusing, so i might be wrong.
AEmer
Illuminati
Posts: 1490
Joined: Fri Jan 26, 2007 12:04 am

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by AEmer »

This is dangerously close to spoilers, but yeah, it's obviously true that the war assets will influence the ending so I guess it's not that major. I will tell you, though, that the numbers you mention are wrong, but to see how I'll need to put it in spoilers:

the game operates with effective war assets, which is total war assets divided by 100 and timed a percentage from 50 to 100. If your friend hasn't played any multiplayer, his effective war assets are only 3250, far short of the 5k figure, because they'll effectively be divided by 2

Also, this is one game where you do not want to spoil yourself...so stay clear of anything that smells even remotely like spoilers till you've completed the entirety of the playthrough. It's doubtlessly the game/story where I've regretted being spoiled the most, ever.
User avatar
Jaedar
Illuminati
Posts: 3937
Joined: Fri Mar 20, 2009 3:01 pm
Location: Terra, Sweden, Uppsala.

Re: What are you playing? Mass Effect 3 edition

Post by Jaedar »

I do beleive you are wrong aemer.

Powers are all good and stuff, but I find that the best guns are waaaay better then all the power spam in the galaxy. I'll take a rapid-firing pistol that oneshots everything(assuming it is headshot) that isn't boss material over 1 second warp cooldown any day. That's not to say powers aren't good, stasis is quite useful for making enemies stand still so I can kill them, and likewise with ai hacking, overload, stuff like that.

It's probably because powers reach the cap way earlier. you can max your damage and cooldown reductions(well almost max) at level 10 or so. The top weapons will enter play waaaaay later, and will as such be more powerful. I've seen other people saying power spam is op, but I don't see it. A biotic combo can one-shot enemies without armor/shields/barriers. A black widow can one shot the same, but also two-shot enemies with those things, which biotic stuff can't do.
VectorM wrote: So, no, you don't need to play the multiplayer for the best ending. You might have to get out of your way to do most of the quests, perhaps, and it will be easier to get it if you do play the multi, but you definitely don't NEED it at all.

Then again, the entire thing is pretty confusing, so i might be wrong.
I can confirm. I have at least one main mission chain left, and my current military strength is a few hundred above 6k. I have done every sidequest so far, but I believe it is completely possible to reach the best ending cap without doing everything, or making the optimal choices.

Such a shame. I was totally ready to praise bioware for making a game where your choices actually mattered to the ending and so on, and then I find out you can get well above the cap.

Spoilers for Ranoshka or whatever is called Quarian homeworld(location spoiler)
Managed to broker peace. Would have been way more emotionally engaged if I had to choose one side. Would have picked Geth, no question about it. Quarians are dicks.

Man, this game has a lot of payoff exclusive to people who played the previous games. Pretty good end to the series so far, but I may change my mind when the biowaree plot tweeeest happens.
Mr_Cyberpunk wrote:ME2 was an ass of a game, especially from a writing standpoint (I hated being Cerberus' lackey for so much of the game.. thats why its off putting to have to play through it again. Because Cerberus suck.)
ME2 is the best mass effect imo. The whole cerberus thing was pretty forced, but it makes quite a lot of sense to ally with them(although they should have built up to it better, by letting you decline, getting shipped back to allience who disowned you, council removed your spectre status and so forth so you actually felt like you had to ally with cerberus to fight the reapers).

Basically it's like shephard says in ME3 when accused of working with Cerberus: "I didn't work for Cerberus, I used their resources to work for me". Aside from that, I think the writing is quite excellent. It has the most interesting moral choices in the series, probably the best characters and probably the greatest enemy variety as well. Suicide mission was pretty cool as well.

What I'm basically saying is that I don't understand why me2 is so hated.
AEmer wrote: And, heh, well I can't recommend playing it as default Shepard.
Indeed, I would not recommend playing me3 without importing a savegame from me2. Preferably one that also has me1 info. There really is a lot of call back, even if it's not that significant.
"Delays are temporary; mediocrity is forever."
odio ergo sum
Post Reply