Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by ggrotz »

FastGamerr wrote:Yeah, the mission control infolinks are always done by Zavich at Yumashev.
Yeah. Just saying I heard one as the boat sped off..
FastGamerr wrote:Did you get David Yoon's infolink after Yakedo upped his price to 2000 credits etc.?
Yes.
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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by FastGamerr »

Hmm. No idea about a random female voice. The Zavich infolink has always played (or supposed to play) at that point (with the boat speeding off in the background) anyhow. Come to think of it, the "boat speeding off" sound is a bit silly at that part anyway since that'd still imply that Yakedo's boat is within a hearing dist--

Anyway, the helicopter guy is supposed to appear in the last cell at the police station after Yoon's infolink is done.

Then again, the coding in the Kowloon levels is (also) a mess, I remember there being a lot of issues related to when/where the police station cops will arrive whether you cause trouble at the club or get them to arrive at the Greasel Pit. And while I remember it working mostly fine back in 2013, the "paying the guy (Forrest) at the club 300 credits so he can run to the bathroom and you can take out the guards for the key" scenario only seems to work these days if you knock out the guards before they get to talk to Forrest, otherwise they just get stuck in an eternal "trying to run into the bathroom" loop or something.

So with all that in mind, I wouldn't be surprised if the helicopter guy didn't appear at all even when he's supposed to.
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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by ggrotz »

FastGamerr wrote:Hmm. No idea about a random female voice.
It's Zavich probably. Weird for it to play during the cut scene though.
FastGamerr wrote: Anyway, the helicopter guy is supposed to appear in the last cell at the police station after Yoon's infolink is done.
I'm not even seeing the police station. I may just cause trouble in the club and run out and see if I see the police coming and maybe take a guess from there.
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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by FastGamerr »

Probably another instance of "FGR coding/conversation editing magic", then. In the same vein, sometimes the helicopter guy transitional cutscene crashes the game, so it's recommended to save the game right before that...

The police station is actually the same one after Yumashev that you can visit later in the mod before breaking into the Forichi Offices. But in the Kowloon scenario, if you get the key (I think it's in the Forichi basement, in the room with the medbot) to the door to Yuanda Zhu Complex, you can get to the police station "early" (as in, what you do in there won't affect the later visit in any way).
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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by ggrotz »

FastGamerr wrote: The police station is actually the same one after Yumashev that you can visit later in the mod before breaking into the Forichi Offices.
I saw that when I figured out it was in the Forichi map and not the Kowloon one. I got to see the entire scenario. Given that, it was an incredibly hard one to do with a lot of very specific actions, mainly not picking up credits anywhere (*) and then fixing the greasel fight so you can lose the 500 credits you show up in Kowloon with (I reckon you could buy something from Jin), I get why people haven't found it. Only question I have left is if there's a way to do it without Chen getting onto you later.

Notably, you can see a bit more of the Yumashev map that you don't normally get to see if you go by helicopter, too.

(*) - I finished with 9100 credits on the main game. It always seems there's scant opportunities to use credits in Deus Ex related gaming.
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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by FastGamerr »

IIRC, even if you buy most (possibly all) of Jin's stuff, get the most credits from Chen as a reward for the HK mission, pay 5000 credits to Alistair, and spend most of the rest of the credits on Larry Fay's pre-White House sale... you'll still have credits to spare. Possibly enough to trigger the +2000 credits bonus at the beginning of the Epilogue DLC (if you had 2000+ credits at the end of Dynamene).
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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by CrocMagnum »

Hello. Since I’ve finished Nihilum Anniversary and the Epilogue DLC, I’ve updated the Deus Ex French Thread with a rundown of the Anniversary Edition (Training DLC, Epilogue DLC, etc). Also the Nihilum mini-faq has been slightly edited:

Deus Ex: Tout est bon dans le Denton! V2

As far as editing the mini-faq it was easy, the main differences were:

1- the different unlockable weapons at Yumashev,
2- the computer change at Tian Bao Hotel,

So when needed I just wrote *Anniversary Edition* or *Nihilum Original* before my commentary. Piece of cake.

***

Now I feel the need to give some feedback here in this thread. There will be praise, questions and rants. :mrgreen: But I wouldn’t go out of way to post this if I didn’t like Nihilum, or Deus Ex for that matter.^^ So:

MAIN GAME

- ressource management is tighter than before. At first I thought I was rusty, but for most of the game I was scrounging for lockpicks, riot prod ammo and gas grenades. Since I was doing a pure non-lethal playthrough I needed those, here’s why:

- from the moment green XVA Commandos show up later in the game I started having a hard time. I mean yeah you can play it sneaky, but sometimes you have to take down 1 or 2 to get access to a security computer for instance. Sadly Tranquilizer Darts don't seem to work on them, and the riot prod requires a few hits to neutralize them,

- I wish to highlight that I didn’t play on Easy Difficulty. Maybe like TNM the number of items varies depending on difficulty?

- So I second what ggrotz said about the scarcity of some items. Even if you go trained in "Lockpicking" or use the "Lockpick Trick" (which is the same, you’ll often end up using 1 lockpick) you’ll hit a wall whatever your play style is because lockpicks are few and far between,

- my basic needs for a Non-Lethal Playthrough are a baton, a crossbow and a riot prod. Now if you don’t choose Low Tech with the Quartermaster in the begining at the MPS HK HQ, you’ll need find those:

# Baton: if I recollect you can get one from Yakedo’s Building in Kowloon,
# Crossbow: I got my first one in Kowloon too in the closed "Burger Boy Restaurant" adjacent to Yakedo,
# Riot Prod: I got my first at Neustad in the building where I met Number One, which is quite late. So my question is: can I get a Riot Prod earlier?

EPILOGUE DLC

- I like the fact you can start this DLC right from the bat, it’s nice touch,

- I was very impressed by the solid Level Design. Compared to the main game the Epilogue DLC is smaller, but it is a very focused experience. It makes you cogitate a lot, it that sense it totally reminds me of Hotel Carone. And that’s a compliment :smile: ,

- issue 1: in the storage Center, Storage Unit 17 has a few Augmentation Canisters and a Repair Bot. I think the more logical choice is to ad a Medical Bot (or put both far that matter^^). Otherwise how am I supposed to install these Canisters? I haven’t found a Med Bot in the vicinity. I don’t count the Med Bot in the Townhall (end game) so the only other I remember is the one at the start of the DLC near the UNATCO soldier and the black van. Is it possible to go back there? Which leads to issue 2:

- issue 2: I didn’t want to go back at the very start of the game, so I pushed my way forward (the Leroy Jenkins that I am^^) and found a radioactive zone in the sewers. Thankfully I found a Hazmat Suit. But from the moment you get past the radioactive zone with the Hazmat Suit this is a one-way trip! You see the problem? You can’t go back to an earlier part (I had in mind that particular Med Bot at the start of the game), and since I didn't have these Augs installed (among which "Environmental Resistance"^^) I pretty much s***** myself,

CONCLUSION

The game is genuinely awesome, when I watched the Credit Roll I read so many contributors to Nihilum my jaw literally dropped. Quite frankly just the fact that you FastGamer suceeded in gathering such a talented voice cast is a feat in itself. Kudos.

I also must confess I didn’t do a perfect playthrough. For instance I think I botched my Epilogue DLC playthrough for the reasons explained above.

Note: Sorry for the lengthy post, man! :mrgreen:

Edit: corrected some spelling errors.
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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by FastGamerr »

"- ressource management is tighter than before"
Yeah, I noticed that the 2013 version of the mod had far too many lockpicks and prod ammo lying around, so I guess I went a bit overboard with removing the excessive ones and turned the mod into having scarcely any such items around... >.<

"Maybe like TNM the number of items varies depending on difficulty? "
That was the intention, but I remembered later on that the engine's own variables for "item shows up in difficulty 1/2/3" seem to be broken and that there was some kinda work-around for that...

"can I get a Riot Prod earlier? "
This one's actually kind of intentional: at MPS HQ, the (lock)pickable drawer on the left side of the mechanic guy has a prod inside (so if you go for a stealthy playthrough, you sorta have to invest on lockpicking already at the very beginning of the game to use all the lockpicks you can find from the MPS HQ area on this drawer). At the moment I can't remember if any of the other pre-Berlin levels have the prod weapon lying around (I sorta remember it being the case, but...)

"it totally reminds me of Hotel Carone. And that’s a compliment"
Indeed it is - thanks CrocMagnum!

"so the only other I remember is the one at the start of the DLC near the UNATCO soldier and the black van. Is it possible to go back there?"
Yup - also intentional that you have to go all the way back to the van at the beginning of the DLC to install the augs.

"But from the moment you get past the radioactive zone with the Hazmat Suit this is a one-way trip!"
IIRC, you can't find any new augs after the radioactive sewers, so you have to handle them before entering that area. If you play the Training DLC first and continue to the Epilogue DLC from there, I think it should be easier. Also, after more or less doing everything in the mod except for disabling the AA grid (so you've talked to ZED-0108 and (possibly) secured the Town Hall area) - if you choose to backtrack to Sagittaire at the beginning, he'll actually say something like "what are you doing here!?" ; D, but otherwise you don't really have to go back ;)

Once again, thanks for the feedback, CrocMagnum! It is indeed wonderful to realize that I managed to get all the voice actors AND other contributors for the mod (including DLC) back in the day - these days I think it'd be harder to gather together such a cast/crew...
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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by ggrotz »

CrocMagnum wrote: - So I second what ggrotz said about the scarcity of some items. Even if you go trained in "Lockpicking" or use the "Lockpick Trick" (which is the same, you’ll often end up using 1 lockpick) you’ll hit a wall whatever your play style is because lockpicks are few and far between,
Indeed. I just played a straight epilogue play-through (matters because it lets you keep your inventory if you go straight from prologue to epilogue) and it was rather tricky on several fronts. Had to backtrack a couple of times for things. Items were just so scarce that I almost felt pigeonholed into playing it one specific way. Managed it, though. Not without breaking a lot of doors though (again). Luckily I managed to find means to do that. Usual problem is those XVA enforcers. They take so much ammo and there's enough of them that it gets pretty hard to deal with them.

That said, CrocMagnum, I read through all your stuff (again?). You ever play Omega (it's on the play through roster of my Youtube account)?
FastGamerr wrote:IIRC, even if you buy most (possibly all) of Jin's stuff, get the most credits from Chen as a reward for the HK mission, pay 5000 credits to Alistair, and spend most of the rest of the credits on Larry Fay's pre-White House sale... you'll still have credits to spare. Possibly enough to trigger the +2000 credits bonus at the beginning of the Epilogue DLC (if you had 2000+ credits at the end of Dynamene).
I definitely believe this from all the other plays I've done. I don't usually buy stuff, but with almost all mods I run into, I could buy just about everything and have more credits to know what to do with. 2027 being a notable exception.
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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by FastGamerr »

ggrotz wrote:Not without breaking a lot of doors though (again).
Just checked the map, apparently you can get the general key for most of the estate doors in the closet next to the basement entrance (so behind the blast door that you'd have to blow up at that point)... I guess for a future update I could make the key be available somewhere else as well? (In which case you'd still need to hack the vents (unless I modified them as well) and use an EMP grenade at least once (the turret in the security(ish) room next to the basement entrance)

Also, one of my intentions was that if you start playing the Epilogue DLC straight from the menu, it's gonna be quite hard... but if you get to it from the Training DLC (or the main mod), it should be a lot easier.

(One of the reasons for this was that I didn't want to make a separate difficulty setting menu for the DLCs)

I can still take suggestions for new item placements, though. ;)
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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by ggrotz »

FastGamerr wrote: Just checked the map, apparently you can get the general key for most of the estate doors in the closet next to the basement entrance (so behind the blast door that you'd have to blow up at that point)...
I found that key towards the end of the game. May have to count how many doors I break one time. I figured out how to solve it, so I'm not too personally bothered that I had to, just seems a little biased towards certain skills over others.

Another note for you to look at with the main game (existed in both original and the new one). On the Illuminati communication Hub level, you might look into seeing what to do to make the login for the computer survivable for the MiB blowing up. When that happens it renders the level unpassable if you don't have hacking. One could draw the MiB away long enough to read the note or knock him out, but if you don't already know the note is there, it makes it pretty hard if you don't realize that the note *should* be there.
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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by CrocMagnum »

ggrotz wrote:...That said, CrocMagnum, I read through all your stuff (again?). You ever play Omega (it's on the play through roster of my Youtube account)?...
Never played the stuff. :mrgreen: Thanks for the heads-up I’ll try it someday.

Now I forgot to mention one thing:

When I was in the Queens, I paid Alistair 5000 credits to benefit for his help later in the Cutter Estate. Still when the assassin MacFarlane spawned and I talked to him, Alistair didn’t show up.

I’ve disabled the bots in the Queens like he asked (and restored his "Dignity" ^^). Did I miss something? Thanks in advance.
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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by FastGamerr »

@ggrotz: Well, how about that, I wasn't even aware that the folders could be destroyed like that (sure, it makes sense though)... as for that plot-important folder, I flagged it as "invincible" for now (will incorporate it in a next mini-update).

@CrocMagnum: Did you do the whole Alistair scenario? As in, pay him the 5000 bucks, get rid of the bots, meet him behind the Johnson Pharmacy, let him roll (i.e. kill all the gang members) all the way to the subway entrance where he's like "LIKE A BOSS!"? Because as soon as he reaches that part, the flag for "Alistair appears to kick MacFarlane's ass at the Estate" is activated.
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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by ggrotz »

CrocMagnum wrote: Never played the stuff. :mrgreen: Thanks for the heads-up I’ll try it someday.
Let me know what you think when you do. Usually, for people I've heard that played it, they usually don't give it a fair shot. There's not too much plot to it, but some decent action sequences that can be a challenge.
FastGamerr wrote:@ggrotz: Well, how about that, I wasn't even aware that the folders could be destroyed like that (sure, it makes sense though)...
I know it's hard to think of everything. That problem is in ZODIAC, too. There's a "go read the diary in dude's safe" mission point. Go into that room, the safe is locked, has a breakable strength...well, a GEP round should solve this...boom - diary gone, can't continue the game...
FastGamerr wrote: @CrocMagnum: Did you do the whole Alistair scenario? As in, pay him the 5000 bucks, get rid of the bots, meet him behind the Johnson Pharmacy, let him roll (i.e. kill all the gang members) all the way to the subway entrance where he's like "LIKE A BOSS!"? Because as soon as he reaches that part, the flag for "Alistair appears to kick MacFarlane's ass at the Estate" is activated.
Addressing @CrocMagnum: Yeah, if you look at the dialogue, the 5000 credits is for his help in clearing out the gangs and not for anything at the Cutter Estate. Which means you have to find him behind the Johnson Pharmacy, follow him through a couple of doors, watch him take out some gang members (if you didn't) and then wait until he gets to the entrance to the Cutter Estate map before he'll show up with MacFarlane.

@FastGamerr: I notice an objective doesn't seem to go out of my list on the first DLC: Make sure that Tom Ryu will survive. When I do backtrack I notice he's in Jake's office. Is there anything in particular you're supposed to do here?
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Re: Deus Ex: Nihilum [Post-Release Issues] [SPOILERS]

Post by FastGamerr »

ggrotz wrote: @FastGamerr: I notice an objective doesn't seem to go out of my list on the first DLC: Make sure that Tom Ryu will survive. When I do backtrack I notice he's in Jake's office. Is there anything in particular you're supposed to do here?
The goal completion check for that one is (IIRC) right after the conversation with Yoon (at which point you shouldn't be able to backtrack to the streets anymore). Mainly so that if you want to continue to the Epilogue DLC, he's got to be alive even after the ambush.
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