Recurring dreams, Deus ex mods, 80s, and NINJAS!

[that guy]

In the one I read you discover that you're an alien when you start having weird dreams about your homeworld and mutating into your true form. As I recall all the endings resulted in you either being killed or captured for scientific research.

[Wounded Ronin]

In the one I read you discover that you're an alien when you start having weird dreams about your homeworld and mutating into your true form. As I recall all the endings resulted in you either being killed or captured for scientific research.

That's really poor, isn't it? I can understand a novel having a bad or tragic ending, but for a game the exercise seems kind of pointless unless you've at least got a small chance of "winning".

[Jonas]

Whether or not that's losing depends what your goal is. Case in point: Torment.

Also it may have been comedy.

[TheUnbeholden]

So, I can imagine a Deus Ex mod set in the 80s that takes place in New York City and Tokyo and focuses on those two locations. I think that the basic weapons in the game would have to be changed to reflect the 80s, so the 10mm pistol would probably become a berretta 92F, etc. I think that the nanotechnology and augmentations that the player has can be taken for granted as they certainly existed in 80s science fiction but perhaps the biolectric cells would have to be replaced with 9 volt batteries or something.

well you can't because nano technology only just became perfected shortly before 2052... and its not even available to the public yet (only Paul/JC/Walton Simons/Bob Page have it). Mechanical augmentation wasn't around for very long before 2027, where the game is set.

So essentially you can't have the game set in the 80s if there where no nano augs or even any mechanical augs... it wouldn't be science fiction... Unless you want to make your own fan fiction/or story. which is ambitious to say the least and I really do think you shouldn't give up on your dreams. But something like this would mean having completely different characters and storyline/weapons/ (and different augs to I assume).

Coming up with ideas for the storyline and characters is the part which you use as a base. Without that, you won't get it off the ground unless you make all the levels and gun/augs first, then once you come up with characters and storyline you can fit it into the levels. I suppose working backwards can work, but you need coders to help you unless you have alot of spare time

[gamer0004]

I would like a DX game set in the 18th century, fighting with primitive firearms and steampunk gagdets (but not over the top steampunk gadgets).

[chris the cynic]

I think that any discussion of how people would make a Deus Ex prequel should be in the thread How would you make a Deus Ex prequel?
(Mostly because I made that thread for that purpose.)

well you can't because nano technology only just came into being in year the game is set, 2052... and its not even available to the public yet. Mechanical augmentation only just became available to the public after the Biopolitic Vote in 2027,

I don't think the original poster was talking about a Deus Ex prequel, I think instead what was being brought up was a mod of Deus Ex that functioned as a stand alone story, not related to Deus Ex except in tone and, probably, gameplay mechanics.

Other than that it is worth mentioning that work on Dentonian nano augmentation started in 2028 (the experiments were carried out five year olds, all of them clones of Paul born in 2023) and it was considered to be perfected in 2049, then Paul was augmented in 2050. So there is a history before 2052.

Also I'm guessing that you're getting the thing about when mechanical augmentation became available to the public from something about Human Revolution. I did not know that, I don't much like it. It makes no sense. Before any other considerations (such as the military ones we see in Deus Ex) prosthetic limbs are a fairly straightforward medical device. Some medical technologies are pretty controversial (genetic engineering in general, almost anything involving a human egg with certain religious groups) and thus might require a vote to be made available, but prosthetic limbs not so much.

The only reason, "Should we allow amputees to get replacement limbs that are capable of doing everything their original ones could, or should we make it illegal for them to get such limbs?" would need to go up for a vote is if there was a large antimech movement before mechs existed. That's not reasonable. It simply doesn't make sense that there would be a backlash against mechs before there were mechs.

Once their are mechs, once people see them on the street, once they get worried about the possibility that their child will spend two hours a day in a classroom with the teacher with the big scarry metal arm... well then it makes more sense for the problems to begin. People who have never heard of mechs, certainly never met one, will hear about them from people who don't like them, any bad thing any mech does can be used as evidence that mechs are horrible people, and the first time a mech committed a violent crime the news media (at least in my country) will kick off a sensationalist shitstorm.

That and a thousand other factors could definitely cause the kind of bigotry Deus Ex tells will exist. The idea that before mechs even existed, people would be so opposed to a new type of prosthetic limb that it couldn't be released to the public without a vote makes no sense. They come out with new types of prosthetic limbs all the time, there's never been a vote on whether they should be legal.

(The above is also true, except for the coming out with new ones all the time thing, when discussing artificial eyes.)

And all of that is to say nothing of the fact that medical technology can rarely be contained by national boundaries. If a company really did devote its resources to to creating prosthetic limbs and then it was voted that they not be allowed in a certain country, the company would simply its business elsewhere. Even if they, for incomprehensible reasons, didn't there would still be people trying to steal, copy, or emulate their designs in a variety of locations throughout the world. The picture Deus Ex paints of the world is one in which, during the 2020s, there was no transnational authority capable of telling the world as a whole, "No one can have these unless everyone agrees in a global vote," so it simply doesn't make any sense that a public vote would control when mechanical augmentation was released to the public.

So essentially you can't have the game set in the 80s if there where no nano augs or even any mechanical augs... it wouldn't be science fiction...

When I brought up the idea of a Deus Ex prequel at Gausswerks one person suggested a game set surrounding the set up of Echelon in 1986, I think their idea could still be seen as science fiction.

That thread can be found here but you have to register to read it.

[TheUnbeholden]

Other than that it is worth mentioning that work on Dentonian nano augmentation started in 2028 (the experiments were carried out five year olds, all of them clones of Paul born in 2023) and it was considered to be perfected in 2049, then Paul was augmented in 2050. So there is a history before 2052.

Thanks! I really should go read the wiki. I've played Deus Ex like 5 times now and I still don't know all the details.

Also I'm guessing that you're getting the thing about when mechanical augmentation became available to the public from something about Human Revolution. I did not know that, I don't much like it. It makes no sense. Before any other considerations (such as the military ones we see in Deus Ex) prosthetic limbs are a fairly straightforward medical device. Some medical technologies are pretty controversial (genetic engineering in general, almost anything involving a human egg with certain religious groups) and thus might require a vote to be made available, but prosthetic limbs not so much.

The only reason, "Should we allow amputees to get replacement limbs that are capable of doing everything their original ones could, or should we make it illegal for them to get such limbs?" would need to go up for a vote is if there was a large antimech movement before mechs existed. That's not reasonable. It simply doesn't make sense that there would be a backlash against mechs before there were mechs.

Once their are mechs, once people see them on the street, once they get worried about the possibility that their child will spend two hours a day in a classroom with the teacher with the big scarry metal arm... well then it makes more sense for the problems to begin. People who have never heard of mechs, certainly never met one, will hear about them from people who don't like them, any bad thing any mech does can be used as evidence that mechs are horrible people, and the first time a mech committed a violent crime the news media (at least in my country) will kick off a sensationalist shitstorm.

That and a thousand other factors could definitely cause the kind of bigotry Deus Ex tells will exist. The idea that before mechs even existed, people would be so opposed to a new type of prosthetic limb that it couldn't be released to the public without a vote makes no sense. They come out with new types of prosthetic limbs all the time, there's never been a vote on whether they should be legal.

(The above is also true, except for the coming out with new ones all the time thing, when discussing artificial eyes.)

And all of that is to say nothing of the fact that medical technology can rarely be contained by national boundaries. If a company really did devote its resources to to creating prosthetic limbs and then it was voted that they not be allowed in a certain country, the company would simply its business elsewhere. Even if they, for incomprehensible reasons, didn't there would still be people trying to steal, copy, or emulate their designs in a variety of locations throughout the world. The picture Deus Ex paints of the world is one in which, during the 2020s, there was no transnational authority capable of telling the world as a whole, "No one can have these unless everyone agrees in a global vote," so it simply doesn't make any sense that a public vote would control when mechanical augmentation was released to the public.

Well we actually don't know anything about the game yet. I was just speculating based off an image in the teaser trailer.
I suppose after hearing your explanation I think I said it wrong... heh

Now that I think about, I said it completely wrong. What I mean is a vote to make them illegal. Because of all the public backlash and all the politicians being put into a situation where they have to choose a side, 'against or for' augs.

I think the Biopotical vote is for a particular government, though I think we can bet it would be a big subject in other countries.
Biopolitics means using modern states and their regulation of their subjects through "an explosion of numerous and diverse techniques for achieving the subjugation's of bodies and the control of populations."

Thanks for telling me all this because I haven't thought about it enough.


For all we know mechanical augs could have been around for a while since 2020, and could have built up alot of worries in the masses. And the sensationalism could have been intensified by having many magazines report on it and media would be sucking up on it quickly due to how it revolutionizes prosthetic limbs... prosthetic limbs would no longer be viewed as something minor or that regular people don't really take notice of or care about (unless they have severed limbs that is ). It would be something that not only makes someone look alot different, but if it comes to state where prosthetic limb would be better then a regular limb (stronger, more durable, while having a great degree of control like regular arm/leg). And lets not even get started on prosthetic organs which you oddly barely mentioned. Eyes, kidneys, that function like regular organs that are widely available (unlike organ donors) but cost alot of money (unless you get it from the black market) so would probably have to be paid off in increments like cars or house mortgage.

Alot of People would be forced to buy the artificial organ because their life depends on it. And this would cause a greater segregation between the rich and poor. Religious societies would have a big say on it I bet And this would form the anti-movements we saw in the videos.

When I brought up the idea of a Deus Ex prequel at Gausswerks one person suggested a game set surrounding the set up of Echelon in 1986, I think their idea could still be seen as science fiction.

That thread can be found here but you have to register to read it.

Yeah thats what I meant when I said fan fiction. Its sounds like a good idea.