GMDX: v4. (HDTP Compatible)

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Blade sword
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by Blade sword »

yeah I will do :)
Cybernetic pig
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by Cybernetic pig »

If anyone has any suggestions regarding how to make Deus Ex/the mod better then offer them now. We are on the final stretch.
We aim to make it the definitive DX campaign mod for the fans in combination with HDTP & New Vision.
Scourge
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by Scourge »

Besides upgraded reaction/turning/fov/hearing range, there's something about Deus Ex's AI that has been bugging me for a long time.

If you have a minicrossbow or a throwable item, you can use it to make an npc turn and stare in the direction the projectile or thrownitem lands when they hear it make a noise. They stay stuck in this state for several seconds, long enough for you to run up and KO them from behind - This also allows multiple quick knockouts without any resistance if you can situate several enemies just right.

While distracting and knocking out an enemy (or several) in this way could be believable, it's simply way too easy and unrealistic in Deus Ex. If I see a dart in the wall, for example, and the dart is in an area clear enough that I can see that it's a dart, or my training is good enough for me to know the sound of a slug or dart hitting the wall (like for MJ12 troops, commandos, or Triads, but probably not for rank and file NSF/UNATCO) I'm going to be alerted to an enemy in the area and check my sixes, not stare at the dart.

Same goes for if my buddies are getting knocked out: I hear a "thwack" behind me, I'm also going to turn around, quickly. Which reminds me - Why do enemies react to dead bodies, but not to unconscious comrades? This makes absolutely zero sense; did Frank the NSF terrorist suddenly decide to fall asleep at his post, flat on his stomach? This ties a bit into my next point:

The reaction times, senses, and spin speed of previously alerted enemies should also be greatly heightened for several minutes after you alert them with a sound or a visual. This holds especially true if someone's been knocked out or killed - enemies should be on hyper-alert if they've noticed. This gives you much bigger incentive to hide bodies after you KO or kill someone. (Body recognition from a distance may also be a very good idea.)

Other minor points: Sounds that you make from drawing or using items, not just weapons or dropping items, should also alert enemies. If I pull out a crinkly bag of soy food or a candy bar or munch it or burp on a soda, that's a sound that's going to draw the attention of extra-alert enemies.

Random turns and checks may be good during "high alert" times. The player should be able to pick up on the fact that some enemies are twitchy or extra investigative, or are extra twitchy after they've been set off.

To end the lecture, coordinate enemies. If they can see a pal running off to investigate something (not just fighting), they should follow. If one ally has one FOV covered, try to make the other ally check in the opposite direction. Enemies are very easy to single out and pick off in Deus Ex.

PS: Good ideas from shifter

- The blackjack
- XP/-XP for killing/KOing badguys/goodguys, with distance or stealth bonuses

Good ideas from other mods

- Change swimming to athletics, decreasing movement noise, increasing speed on land, water, and on ladders
Cybernetic pig
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by Cybernetic pig »

Hmm, all vanilla AI suggestions. Probably the biggest problem with the game though.
Scourge wrote:Besides upgraded reaction/turning/fov/hearing range, there's something about Deus Ex's AI that has been bugging me for a long time.
If you have a minicrossbow or a throwable item, you can use it to make an npc turn and stare in the direction the projectile or thrownitem lands when they hear it make a noise. They stay stuck in this state for several seconds, long enough for you to run up and KO them from behind - This also allows multiple quick knockouts without any resistance if you can situate several enemies just right.
This has already been resolved and will be featured in the next release. Yeah they were easily exploitable because of that.
Same goes for if my buddies are getting knocked out: I hear a "thwack" behind me, I'm also going to turn around, quickly.
All melee weapons make striking noise except the baton and the prod. It's a gameplay over realism thing. The silence is those weapon's true advantage. Without it things would be frustrating for non-lethal players, since enemies are often grouped together and non-lethal-only players have the least amount of options/tools and the highest level of difficulty of all playstyles as a result.
Which reminds me - Why do enemies react to dead bodies, but not to unconscious comrades? This makes absolutely zero sense; did Frank the NSF terrorist suddenly decide to fall asleep at his post, flat on his stomach? This ties a bit into my next point:
This is one I will strongly consider. They will need dialogue though...
The reaction times, senses, and spin speed of previously alerted enemies should also be greatly heightened for several minutes after you alert them with a sound or a visual. This holds especially true if someone's been knocked out or killed - enemies should be on hyper-alert if they've noticed. This gives you much bigger incentive to hide bodies after you KO or kill someone. (Body recognition from a distance may also be a very good idea.)
This would be insanely difficult to pull off convincingly, we would want new AI behaviour such as new barks/dialogue, searching the area, and communicating and acting as a team. It would significantly improve the game, but it's a project in itself.
When on alert just increasing stats as an alternative is do-able, but the stats are already at a nice new standard. They are still pretty dumb but are slightly more believable and pose a threat.
Other minor points: Sounds that you make from drawing or using items, not just weapons or dropping items, should also alert enemies. If I pull out a crinkly bag of soy food or a candy bar or munch it or burp on a soda, that's a sound that's going to draw the attention of extra-alert enemies.
Hmm. Bit of a controversial one. Realistic, forces the player to be more careful, but could be a pain in the backside. I like it.
I am very conflicted though, requires further discussion I think.
I believe for this to happen the player would have to have the option to control how fast they draw weapons each time, and whether they softly burp inside their mouths or not (lol). I am big on gameplay depth and simulation but there is a thin line between necessary simulation design and unnecessary...I don't know. Your thoughts? The burp control was a joke btw, sort of. We'll leave that to VR, when it one day comes around, but the weapon draw speed is interesting, I think. (Simple example: Hold Y whilst switching to draw weapons slowly and silently).
To end the lecture, coordinate enemies. If they can see a pal running off to investigate something (not just fighting), they should follow. If one ally has one FOV covered, try to make the other ally check in the opposite direction. Enemies are very easy to single out and pick off in Deus Ex.
Hmm, simpler coordination than I'd like, but worth doing. Again though they'd need dialogue to match to make it truly convincing. Will consider looking into the chain reaction investigation suggestion, of up to 3 pawns at once, with a bit of random wandering or something, not sure.
PS: Good ideas from shifter - The blackjack
Yeah, the blackjack is a good idea from Shifter. Will consider implementing something like it.
- XP/-XP for killing/KOing badguys/goodguys, with distance or stealth bonuses
This penalizes playstyles, discourages creative play/ways to deal with enemies. Deus Ex's vanilla xp rewards system is perfection; exploration and objectives only.
- Change swimming to athletics, decreasing movement noise, increasing speed on land, water, and on ladders
GMDX completely rebalances the individual skills, which were far from perfect. All skills are viable now, including swimming. Also adds a stealth skill (next release).

Thanks for the suggestions. If you are interested in playing the mod wait for the next (final, for real this time) release. 2 week's time hopefully.
I am going to be so proud come release.

Oh, another AI thing we have done is given them the ability to push light weight - middle weight boxes, there is no animation, but at least if the player blocks a path way with a box and the AI attempt to run through as they like to do then the box will shift along.

The pain sounds are much more believable now.

The late game enemies are more challenging, have a chance to stand against the player's god tier power (and have been further polished since last release).

Reactions of all types are just much better and more believable (except to comrade carcasses).

A fair bit has been done for AI but probably not enough, about the only thing I feel we haven't done enough for. Will look into carcass reactions that is for sure. Though may have to have no dialogue for this, just come running over and then start random wandering for a set amount of time, and that wouldn't be too great, but better than what it is currently at least.
Zireael
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by Zireael »

I like the Stealth skill and some of the changes. What is the new aug?
Cybernetic pig
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by Cybernetic pig »

Update:

-1 new weapon.
-A focus on making the guns "feel" better. This includes 7 new sounds, further improved ballistics impact effects, and a little bit of camera shake effect when firing.
-GEP gun now has three fire modes: Normal/unguided (just shoot). Laser guided (think Half-life, attach and toggle laser mod), and player remote guided (Think Deus Ex: Invisible War steering of rockets, attach and use scope).
-Fixed HDTP GEP and LAW models visible culling with kenties launcher default FOV.
-Fixed GMDX throwing bug where a certain type of vase did not break.
-If NPC's (most types) bump into pushable objects then they move in the smae manner as the player pushing of deco (chairs, boxes etc).
Zireael wrote:I like the Stealth skill and some of the changes. What is the new aug?
Kick Aug. Refer to the previous page. Stealth skill may enable pickpocketing of keys also, not sure yet.
Scourge
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by Scourge »

Are NPCs alerted when you walk by with a crate of TNT?
Cybernetic pig
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by Cybernetic pig »

Scourge wrote:Are NPCs alerted when you walk by with a crate of TNT?
Can you elaborate on this? Friendly NPCs?
DDL
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by DDL »

Cybernetic pig wrote:Update:

Laser guided (think Half-life, attach and toggle laser mod)
Goddamnit. I've had that for aaages. I really should just release the shit I've made before you replicate all my ideas. :(
Cybernetic pig
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by Cybernetic pig »

Well, I'm still waiting for that grenade throwing inaccuracy code you promised :P
DDL
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by DDL »

Are you? I thought you said you didn't need it anymore?
Cybernetic pig
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by Cybernetic pig »

DDL wrote:Are you? I thought you said you didn't need it anymore?
Hmm, I don't remember saying such a thing, but I'll take your word for it.
Zireael
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by Zireael »

The kick aug sounds insanely cool, somewhat like DX HR takedowns but without taking away control and allowing for non-lethal easily.... I applaud you for that!
DDL
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by DDL »

FWIW, here's the nade code. It's ridiculously simple: basically multiply the player's accuracy by 10 (acc decreases as it gets better, so larger numbers are worse) and then also use the player's accuracy to adjust the distance thrown (+ random factor).

So at untrained you throw a grenade and it might spaff off to the right unexpectedly, or simply drop to the ground three feet away. At master you're back to pinpoint targeting again. Ish.

Also, I changed it so that augCombat doesn't now apply a damage multiplier, because SRSLY WTF.

This code should go in your actual weapon classes (LAM/EMP/Nanovirus etc) rather than in deusexweapon, since I assume you still want accuracy and damage for throwing knives and shit to remain unaltered?

Code: Select all

simulated function Projectile ProjectileFire(class<projectile> ProjClass, float ProjSpeed, bool bWarn)
{
	local Vector Start, X, Y, Z;
	local ThrownProjectile proj;
	local float mult, tempacc;
	local float volume, radius;
	local int i, numProj;
	local Pawn aPawn;

	// AugCombat increases our speed (distance) if hand to hand
	mult = 1.0;
	if (bHandToHand && (DeusExPlayer(Owner) != None))
	{
		mult = DeusExPlayer(Owner).AugmentationSystem.GetAugLevelValue(class'AugCombat');
		if (mult == -1.0)
			mult = 1.0;
		ProjSpeed *= mult;
		//and now reset it because augcombat shouldn't fucking affect BOMBS
		mult = 1.0;
	}

	// skill also affects our damage
	// GetWeaponSkill returns 0.0 to -0.7 (max skill/aug)
	mult += -2.0 * GetWeaponSkill();

	// make noise if we are not silenced
	if (!bHasSilencer && !bHandToHand)
	{
		GetAIVolume(volume, radius);
		Owner.AISendEvent('WeaponFire', EAITYPE_Audio, volume, radius);
		Owner.AISendEvent('LoudNoise', EAITYPE_Audio, volume, radius);
		if (!Owner.IsA('PlayerPawn'))
			Owner.AISendEvent('Distress', EAITYPE_Audio, volume, radius);
	}

	// should we shoot multiple projectiles in a spread?
	if (AreaOfEffect == AOE_Cone)
		numProj = 3;
	else
		numProj = 1;

	GetAxes(Pawn(owner).ViewRotation,X,Y,Z);
	Start = ComputeProjectileStart(X, Y, Z);

	if(playerpawn(owner) != none)
		tempacc = currentaccuracy * 10;
	else
		tempacc = currentaccuracy; //NPCs are bad enough as is

	for (i=0; i<numProj; i++)
	{
	  // If we have multiple slugs, then lower our accuracy a bit after the first slug so the slugs DON'T all go to the same place
	  if ((i > 0) && (Level.NetMode != NM_Standalone))
		 if (currentAccuracy < MinProjSpreadAcc)
			currentAccuracy = MinProjSpreadAcc;

		AdjustedAim = pawn(owner).AdjustAim(ProjSpeed, Start, AimError, True, bWarn);
		AdjustedAim.Yaw += tempacc * (Rand(1024) - 512);
		AdjustedAim.Pitch += tempacc * (Rand(1024) - 512);



			proj = ThrownProjectile(Spawn(ProjClass, Owner,, Start, AdjustedAim));
			if (proj != None)
			{
                //testing skill-based velocity randomiser
				proj.Speed *= 1 - (tempacc*frand()*0.05); //so standing also helps
				proj.MaxSpeed = proj.speed;
				// AugCombat increases our damage as well
				proj.Damage *= mult;

				// send the targetting information to the projectile
				if (bCanTrack && (LockTarget != None) && (LockMode == LOCK_Locked))
				{
					proj.Target = LockTarget;
					proj.bTracking = True;
				}
			}

	}
	return proj;
}
Edit: also there's a fuckton of code in there that's utterly irrelevant for thrown projectiles, which could probably be trimmed out if you were so inclined. It doesn't hurt anything, it's just untidy.
Cybernetic pig
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Re: GMDX: Gameplay Mod. Final Version Released (HDTP Compati

Post by Cybernetic pig »

DDL wrote: This code should go in your actual weapon classes (LAM/EMP/Nanovirus etc) rather than in deusexweapon, since I assume you still want accuracy and damage for throwing knives and shit to remain unaltered?
Yes. Thank you very much.
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